Do we improve them for the next woman?

I think the only thing we do is perhaps teach them new tools for the "game" they play. In the end, they will always lack empathy and that is something no one is going to be able to "teach" these Ns. The characters may change, but the movie will inevitably be the same (with the same lovely (yes, I am being sarcastic here) D&D at the end).

I remember thinking and worrying about that too. I don't think we have that much power though. They may learn new "tricks" but in the long run, they can't sustain their act for good. Sooner or later, their real side will surface. I wouldn't say the next woman "benefits".....I mean if he has learned to be even MORE deceptive than he was with us....how is that in her favour? ya know?

For the next woman, as a serial killer learning how to capture their next victims in better ways from the last one that will get them off (their rocks) and how to hide their evil side to gain trust more in the "next woman".

Agree with these comments - mine said he didn't WANT anyone, he wanted to be celibate (yeah right), to concentrate on his own life (for a change?!) and that it wouldn't matter if the most gorgeous woman in the world wanted him, he was too busy in his own 'space' to bother - BUT when the time was right, he would find someone (not me) and modify his (appalling) behaviour. This stinks on so many levels. The brainwashing led me to believe that I really was undesirable and that he is going to skip off into the sunset with a perfect life and a perfect wife. I DO twist myself up in knots wondering if he he is doing this while I am left with the wreckage of the havoc he brought into my life

No...they don't change. How do I know? My ex had 4 ex WIVES. And when he got to me, he said he'd do anything to make it work. That he wouldn't ignore a woman telling him things, like he did in the past. hahaha!! Right. Only thing they get better at is their game. They become more focused...more cunning...more spiteful...more vengeful. The next woman is punished for the prior breakups. Believe me. I remember even saying those words to him--I feel like I'm being punished for what your 3rd...4th...wife did. He would never answer. And the next woman will pay the price for what he perceives was my fault. That is probably what happens with the ''next'' women.

To me it doesn't matter. They didn't treat us properly. So what if they choose to do better with someone else? The damage was done to us! I say No THEY DO NOT change - they just change their game! Whatever you imagine in your head that the OW will have it better than you - give it time. There is nothing else YOU could of done to make this relationship work because they ARE fundementaly flawed and disordered. The other side of the coin is they do evolve and they do find just the 'right' girl that will twist herself in to a pretzel for him - just for his benefit- so yes it works but not because of his love appreciation and caring of her but because she bends over backwards, sacrificing her dignity, respect and worth to please him. It still always ends the same. We can't control this. These questions really have no answers but hypothosis and ideas that some one else will have it better than we did. It just simply isn't true.

My ex-n sent me text yesterday saying 'You are the best friend I have ever had' I wanted to punch back a text that said 'I was your lover and wife and childs mother too!!!!!!' what about that? But I didnt cos I knew that in his distorted screwed up mind that it was not an insult to devalue our relationship to nothing more than 'freinds' but that he was givng what he thought to be a complaiment. THEY ARE DELUDED!!!! Agin here we have the madonna/whore complex. He is off screwing a woman who is well known for having lots of men drop at her feet. and back in the kept family home is the nice cosy secure 'friend'... Wicked!!! BUT NO I dont know if we improve them.. I do agree with others here that they might learn what works and what doesnt and they get pretty clever at working out how to manipulate. They had a repotiore before they hooked up with us and now you can be sure they have more after us. At the death, these guys just dont have a soul. He is looking in her eyes loved up on a chemical high and I actually think in their heads when they first embark on a new relatiosnhip, they actaully believe that the new womans traits are fnatastic. They do massivly inflate the womans ego at the start. I guess they gauge how gullable she is and atune to her thinking. and what works for us migth nor work for her... Maybe he has to work harder on each woman as he goes. WE are just test pilots for the next swoop. BUT IN THE END... You just can NOT rosy up a DOG POO... These guys might work out what went wrong and try to avoid it to retain the good parts of the new rleationship for longer but like others have said here, they cant change, they wont meet another woman and have a personality transplant.. they just refine the art of manipulation flattery and control through what ever tools they have at there disposale.

Since they were narcissists from early age and since people's reactions to everything are mostly similar and easy to predict, at least when it comes to average mind,buy the time they encounter us they have already mastered all of it, so they always have plan A,B,C and all letters in the alphabet and more! They were trained [self-trained] in subtle [hidden] torture of others their whole life and they are exceptionally intelligent, they can always figure out a variations of all they know, and you know about combinations and variations, they can be in infinite number, when you take one method apart in pieces and combine it with something else or arrange it differently. I have noticed that is what they actually do. So they always have a lot of variations and different methods in mind which lead to the same outcome cause that is what they focused their whole life on and they know we will figure out what they are doing but they are always one step forward then us, that is why we can't really outwit them. I am not sure if we train them to become better or not, but probably yes, but we also make them spend more time and energy training themselves to keep in step with us so in a way we are destroying them, taking the focus from other things in their lives on us and how much we know and how to outwit us all the time. Narcissism already takes up a lot of their energy and time,so if we keep going with this, they will waste more energy and time or they won't have that much energy and time, that is why they quickly get rid of one victim and find someone who has no clue to torture. In a way we torture them too - when they lose a victim they are lost, confused, depressed, frustrated, angry. Their admirers and friends act as narcissistic supply but they serve one more purpose, when they lose one victim it is easy for them to get another one out of a lot of fans and friends they have, that is why they aim to gather as many admirers as they can. That way, they know, out of so many admirers they will find next life partner immediately, their next victim....

I totally get what you are saying/asking here. I can remember thinking along these same lines too. The answer though....is NO...we do not "improve" them for the next gal. Maybe they "learn" something from what we say, in that they develop new TRICKS to use.... but ultimately....this doesn't IMPROVE them..... In the long run they are still the same phoney act they always were.....and their true side will still eventually surface.

SO LAME! When I think of that person 33 yrs old & still pretending to be 18 yrs old--ugh, so stupid and the females he used (found this out later) doing his college homework for him... They get theirs, I believe it & I hold onto that fact, God is never mocked. Ever...one thing for sure, you play you pay & what comes around does go back around...God is already taking care of things...when I was with ex- I would tell him, "I am fine if you leave and completely understand" when I felt he was cheating emotionally or whatever--he would get this confused look...and I would feel like...dang, I am so glad I can let this piece of work go--even though I didn't think I was. I hate thinking back to that waste of time that it was. I hate that a person of that low empty shell could hold anything about me--pretending to go to church, poser indeed--but it all falls apart and as for the new girl deal-- I read the best payback is when they are old, these N's and how they can get NO one to be around them--they build such a horrific life of burning people, NO ONE gets close, even their own children are spent---so they get what they want, their one man show, with their undivided attention only to realize they are like those cartoon deals on the Little Mermaid when Ariel swims by, shriveled old nothings that traded their soul for their pornographic lies--which ultimately destroyed themselves... The mention of feeding poison--I think they are the only ones really eating it though--we get an initial taste & spend the rest of the time vomiting it up, knowing somethings wrong being innately allergic to these people who are never ever ever going to be happy--they don't know what it is to be "satisfied or joyful" in this life. Its all too self-concious, its like being in middle school permanently--confused and trying to fit in & never knowing what will be accepted, sure you can fake it for a bit, but really society knows who the fakes are and nobody wants to be the wife of the "Great Handsome, Amazingly Hardworking FAKE" he's nobody's envy & even other men are just like "ugh" cause they are not real men--only cowards who when tested fall bitterly short and every day they try to hide it from themselves and get others to believe it but as they get older the don't have enough energy for the game, so hence the Hugh Hefners-old decrepit & utterly repulsive-- and in an article it said he can't even get with women, its all so tired for him--what a legacy-- http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2003/december/5.50.html Peace Be Upon Us Ladies, it WILL be alright in the end...

All the ten years with me he pretended to be single on FB. After only a few months with new GF after he moved away, he posted two pictures of them together on dates at public places grinning. One with her throwing herself on him looking up to him in rapture. He did not want to be photographed with me unless he had to. He did seem to like my looks and I was his GF. But he disrespected me keeping me at home alot while he prowled. This one is at least getting the public respect that he has a GF to all his fans and friends on FB. Isn't that treating someone better? Unless they are both N's that like to be seen... He is not too bright and she looks fairly dim too (sorry but thats what i think...).

They don't change the mask may be on different because of different women but after awhile they can't keep up their act. Mines was gone for 2 years and came back worse smh and it wasn't long either to see something was not right . but i was a fighter after what happened the first time see i had more control because it was my place. so we argued and disagreed alot. he told me before he left i was a woman that treated him like shyt for years. that hurt when he said that i battled with that crap for awhile. i honestly was questioning was i the reason he cheated. then i found this site and found the narcspeak info that made me feel a hell of alot better and i knew who was really at fault ...

Mine said he had learned from the mistakes he made with me and the OW just prior to me that he only had a relationship with for a few months. This didn't mean he had learned to be a better man and would truly change (although I think that's what he believes in his mind), but he learned how to present himself better to make the illusion last longer. That is my opinion anyway, based on everything I've read. I think he recognizes his new victim as a better long-term source of secondary supply because of so many things that fall into place for him making it easier and more convenient. If he were to do his checklist of qualities/things/conveniences she can offer or him vs. me (which he has), she wins hands down at this point. because he's just really comparing the pros and cons of two objects, like cars. Although, I have had cars I probably miss more than he misses me. I think I taught him things he wasn't exposed to before, like appreciating good wine for example. He never liked wine before, but by the end of our relationship, he knew what to look for on the label when buying a bottle, and was just becoming accustomed to the taste. Of course now that he's with OW, he's buying wine at restaurants and I'm sure impressing her with knowledge he gained from me. I taught him lots of things he can now benefit from for his next relationship. One of the worst things for me to deal with in the beginning was thinking she was worthy of the respect he was having for her feelings that he never had for mine, because he's done a 180 on his approach with her. Changed up his Ladies Man persona on FB, quit interacting with every woman who crosses his path, etc.. Made me feel like dog shit. But now that I realize what he is and how disordered he is, I realize that the "respect" he's showing her is part of his image campaign to ensnare her in his trap. She is not better than me, I am not better than her, he just learned that his bullshit made me catch on to him faster and he could have used me and worked it longer had he played his cards differently. Still sucks though. ;o(

I remember during one of our arguments he told me that he learned what mistakes NOT to make with the next woman from me...that he would treat her better...different (this post actually just made me remember this!) I was so enraged...like I was an experiment gone bad. He injected me with poison, watched me die & then said "geez, I won't do that again". NOW I have clarity & I KNOW in my heart that he said this only to hurt me just like the narc he is. He won't change & the next woman will also be injected with his poison. They might learn how to mirror our emotions in order to manipulate better or quicker but that doesn't equal treating someone better or being capable of loving someone. I don't buy for a second that they go on to happy, healthy relationships.

They're as emotionally dead as a door nail...nothing will change them...this too is all an illusion. In one ear, out the other... Not possible. Hugs!

And ME(???) The ex-Psych prof D&D'd me for his long-distance girlfriend from LA, a curator (formerly of LACMA) who resembled him...and in some bizarre ways, me. When I saw them at a concert together, they didn't put on the Cute Loving Couple Act. They didn't even act interested in each other. They didn't hold hands. No kissing. They acted as passionate as siblings. She mirrored him perfectly. She dressed like him, had a crew cut like him, wore pants suits and tank tops.* They practically wore matching outfits. Sometimes I think the ex-P didn't need to groom her. If she was as much a Narc as him, he didn't have to work to mold her into his image. Early on, the ex-P accused me of being a Narc&being a lesbian... and some of my classmates speculated was that a self-centered lesbian was his concept of a perfect partner. When the ex-P married her, he took on her last name along with his. Whether she's still a curator or not, I don't know. She struck me as shallow, bland, emotionless, but not malicious like him. IMHO, he wanted a narcissist with whom to share his life. Someone who mirrored him. *The ex-P would talk about how he wanted to spend the rest of his life with a woman who admired his writings. He used the example of Arthur Schopenhauer. In his final years, Schopenhauer enjoyed the companionship of sculptor Elisabeth Ney (despite the fact he deemed women incapable of success, let alone artistic success,and she was successful) Ney was a very masculine woman in her behavior&dress. She even pretended to be single despite being married.

I don't think so, they learned how to manipulate and charm at a very young age, they "mimic" others as they go along in life but ultimately the mask will still slip off and reveal the "real" them, they are great actors, and likely pick up on somethings they see and hear but they pretty much mirror the person they are grooming as supply, but for them to "think" back in time about the things we have said and done, lol, wow...I don't think they have the capacity to do so, they live in the moment, jmho.