I need real advice..please don't be too tough...

I'm 29. I went back. He seemed so different. Like you said, he was caring, full of promises, dreams, hope, love--you name it. That lasted about 3 months in my case. Then he started with the flirting. Then came the evil, venomous words directed at me. It got worse. Virtually everything I believed in was devalued. He contridicted himself a lot which left me confused. I wasn't good enough for him in his mind. (In reality I went broke trying to keep him happy & afloat--he'd lost his job & didn't bother trying to find a new one.) I was never happy enough (hello? he did pull a ton of Mel Gibson type rants on me & I was walking on eggshells!) Either way the fact remains the same. I wish I didn't try. I'm at my rock bottom now. I love him but not his monsterous side. I miss him & the good times. I feel dead inside after this brutal mindfucking. Please don't risk your sanity as I did. It's not worth this pain, emptiness, and he owes me a lot of money I may never see.

because thankfully, I never went back to any of them. I would love for my last ex N to contact me so that I could ignore him. Honestly . . . It's the only thing upon reflection that makes me feel somewhat strong. I was suckered in once - understandably so - How was I supposed to know what would happen - and now that I have actually educated myself, I think I have the tools to be strong enough to leave when I start seeing the signs. I came very close to getting sucked back in to the most damaging sociopath I have been with. Just allowing myself to talk to him - he was playing his manipulative games. Fortunately, I was already dating someone else, so he had heavy competition and couldn't hook me in. If I was single, he might have been able to. It would have been the worst mistake of my life. After everything I have read and learned - - they don't change - their game plan might change to get you back - but they actually only get worse . . . Do you really think you need to get burned again? What for?

You have not come to the point where ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. I was exacty where you are last April 2009. We`d split up, yet again, for eight weeks. At that time I had not called the police and I had not changed my numbers so suffice to say he was in contact constantly trying to hoover me back in and although I was ignoring all his failed attempts (ladders to my bedroom window, stalking, pleading, begging, aggressiveness, threats, rages, then back to pleading, crying, begging) he finaly got to me one day when I agreed to talk with him, after he`d been waiting for my return outside my home and I allowed him into my car to talk. I had soooooo missed him. He sat the closest hed been in 8 weeks. I observed him. He looked thinner, face a little haggard (which pulled at my heart strings) yet still looked soooo handsome. He had facial stubble I abso loved on him, hair gelled in my favourite style, was wearing my favourite white shirt Id bought him which I loved against the olive colour of his skin and his smell............the aftershave he always wore....................his voice..............everything about him seemed to gel us into ONE. i FELT I TRULY WAS MEANT TO BE WITH THIS GUY. Here he was after 8 weeks still going strong in getting me back.He sounded genuine, matter of fact, serious with his feelings and his proposals of how to correct the problems. WHAT IF I WAS WRONG. WHAT IF THIS MAN WAS THE LOVE OF MY LIFE AND WHAT IF WHAT HE WAS SAYING TO ME IN THE CAR ABOUT CHANGING, GOING TO ANGER MANAGEMENT, THERAPY WHATEVER IT TOOK TO KEEP US TOGETHER AS WE HAD SUCH A GOOD THING. ETC ETC ETC.WAS GOING TO BE THE FINAL FIX. . My head was fuzzy. I was like a robot. I truly had to think about it just like you are doing now. I so loved this man. I explained what had happened and how sincere he was to friends asking them the very same as you are asking now. They all said as we are saying on this board PLEASE DONT GO BACK. HE WILL NOT CHANGE. Even with this advice, I still couldnt quite shift my feelings of trying just ONE MORE TIME. I FELT I HAD TO GIVE HIM ONE MORE CHANCE. I even took a day off work the next day and booked to see an advisor urgently at a place for abused women. I sat and explained my story and asked her if she could tell me what percentage of men like this ever change. Can they get better. She told me she had been in the police force, a parole officer and now a victim support advisor,shed written a booklet on this type of personality disorder. She said THEY DO NOT CHANGE. They will act a change but the cycle of abuse will keep returning. They are wired that way. The nice guy is the fake guy, the true guy is the abuser. She asked me "In the four years you have been together with your break ups and make ups, has it got better or worse?" I sat there and cried.........of course it had got worse..........that`s why I was there talking to her. YET.....................armed with what she said and what my friends advised............I decided to still go back. I had to give him one more try. I was sooooo deeply in love with this man. It also seemed he was deeply in love with me. I asked my friends to please understand that I had to give it one more try. They stood by me and literally waited........................... And.........................it was heaven as usual, all was normal, I actually thought we`d cracked it this time, there were no signs of his past deceipts...................until August 23rd 2009 (which incidentally I will be celebrating next week as a years NC). The questionables had started seeping in again. And on questioning those qeustionables as there shouldnt have been any deceipts, we were supposedly truly happy, nothing had gone wrong, this time the rages were the worst Id had before and cutting the story short it ended in a very cruel, violent beating. FINALLY for me ENOUGH WAS ENOUGH. He was still telling me he loved me even whilslt that was happening and kept following me everywhere I went afterwards. Please do not waste any more of your precious time and your beautiful life on this man. It truly is not worth it. My xN was very clever within our relationship he would treat me like a princess taking me to the highest cloud nine so I was forever stimulatingly happy whilst at the very same time insiduously using the gaslighting, projection, blame shifting, intimidation, pathological lying techniques which increased to physical violence when questioned on a questionable. He was certainly carrying on with everything he was doing all the time we`d been which caused all our problems but each time he just got better and better at covering it up. The typical Dr. Jekyle/Mr. Hyde character. That`s why it is so hard to leave. You have to leave the man you are deeply in love with, Dr. Jekyle because of the awful,dangerous man, Mr. Hyde. If he were just a Mr. Hyde, you wouldnt think twice leaving that guy..... nutter..... loser....... freak of nature...... good riddence...... on your way and never look back......easy peasy......absolute HELL. Won`t make that mistake again. But.......Dr. Jekyle.......hes a completely different kettle of fish.......as I`ve said before........ Mills and Boons in reality.....best thing ever.......soul mate......everything you could ever wish for in a man and more.......absolute HEAVEN. He`s the one that is so difficult to leave behind. Yet leave him behind you must. NO CONTACT,NO CONTACT, NO CONTACT. IT IS THE ONLY WAY.

Ditto with everything everyone has said. What happened to Amy happened exactly that same way with me. My N said the EXACT same thing yours said..."Oh, I don't want to loose you, let's take it slow, I will go to church, there must be a reason we keep coming back to each other, I am scared to live with out you, I wouldn't be calling you if I didn't really mean to try again, etc) One week after that he went back to the bimbo, didn't tell me he did, took me out for our "beautiful day" together and never once reached out for me romantically and then said..."Gee, if we get back together someday...." OMG!! And then the next day there was yet another D&D!! These guys are crazy. I am sorry to be so harsh. I understand what you feel. Deep in my heart I wish my Narc would change. I miss what I THOUGHT we had. I miss it so much that I still toss and turn and night. He reached out to me about a month ago and was sending me texts, emails, a few calls every day. I didn't want to see him, but I just accepted his texts and emails and broke NC. I wanted to see what he would do. And sure enough, I haven't heard from him now in about 9 days. He disappeared again. I'm certain he is off hiking, sailing, camping, what ever with some whore bimbo again. PLEASE listen to us. They WILL not change. We will be here for you when you need us. Thank God for the ladies on this site. My friends who love me dearly didn't understand. But everyone here does. And I thank God for Betty, Lisa and everyone here. LOVE YOU!! xoxo AC

Sarah I was you. I did go back and I regret it everyday because the things they do become worse and the ways they leave become way more painful . I wish I was back at my 23 year old self 4 years ago and I would have said no I am not getting back with you because the pain I would have spared myself and now my children. The sweet talk is just that it's talk he needs something from you. Remember a conscience is an underlying feeling of obligation to others. WHen you don't feel obligated to do certain things then the fact that he has hurt you 100 times won't matter when it comes time for him to leave. He will go on his merry way and act like you are nothing. You've made it 6 months that's past the hardest part keep going and put this behind you!

The fact that you're stopping to ask this forum means that you're stopping yourself to take a GOOD look at what you're heading back into. I can say with complete conviction that HE WILL NOT CHANGE. He will be able to pretend to be the person he knows you need him to be - that's how he got you hooked in the first place. But PLEASE do for yourself the thing that I could not do - GIVE YOURSELF TIME TO MAKE YOUR DECISION. Time is the most important thing for you now. I went through your present state of mind for 8 years! I've been EXACTLY where you are now emotionally more times than I can count. Because I loved him, because I wanted the life he promised, because I had invested myself emotionally, I kept believing that he wanted to change and wanted the same things that I wanted. Know this - they want ONLY what THEY want - NOT WHAT YOU WANT! I would give anything to have those 8 years back and know then what I have painfully learned from this experience. You will get past your feelings and find a wonderful man who is normal and can love you and make you happy - FOCUS ON THAT!!! I know you will be able to move on to a happier life with someone else. Believe in yourself! Terri

Im sorry honey that you have to see more and have not hit your bottom yet. . I want you to understand that when you go back, it will be worse this time. He has not changed. You will be back to us in time and we will be here for you. I will pray for you sarah.......xoxo only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

I went and read your story also. This guy is a tool and I am very concerned for you. Real men don't threaten people they love with hitting them! You need to go completely no contact! That is the only way you will get past this. If not he will suck you in and do it all over again and God forbid you get pregnant and then you will have to deal with him for the rest of your life. RUN, don't walk RUN in the opposite direction!!!

Hi Sarah, You may want to read your story again. I think it says it all. This relationship has all the signs of a toxic relationship. Why does it matter if he is a true narc or if you have more narc tendencies? I would not even attempt to diagnois either one of you without many more facts and even then it does not matter in this case. He is a sex addict. He is a serial cheater. He told you had an ugly face and calls you crazy. He blames you for everything and likes to keep you feeling bad about yourself. So what if he lets you hang with your friends and can be nice to you sometimes. My N/P let me hang with my friends and he is a classic narc. You are obsessive and jealous around him (not a good way to begin a life together)and why is this? Could it be that you do not trust him? Once again, real bad sign. You "love" him no matter what he says or does (not a good example of real love of self or him). Your family and friends do not like him (MAJOR RED FLAG). I have never been with a truly good guy that my family and friends did not like. The only ones they did not like are the ones who turned out to be no good for me. My son is 24 years old and he has not slept with anywhere near 45 girls, and he would NEVER tell anyone they had an ugly face. Reality check: All guys DO NOT SLEEP AROUND. All guys DO NOT CALL YOU NAMES. All guys DO NOT BLAME YOU FOR EVERYTHING and cheat on you. Close your eyes and picture a life with a guy who calls you crazy and ugly and doesn't get along with your family and friends and cheats on you and threatens to hit you. Does this sound normal to you, seriously?? Can you picture bringing children into this arrangement? Do you want them to see their mother being treated like this? You ask if he can change? My honest opinion, NO NO NO. I have NEVER seen someone like this change very much. The way you treat and talk to others is pretty well ingrained by the time you are his age and I think the only reason he is back is because you have changed, you are stronger now, you have given him some NC. The minute he has you back in his clutches, his true self will shine again and do you really want to go back over this worn out path? Can he PRETEND to change? Oh sure for a short while and then it's back to the same ole same. These are all questions you need to ask yourself. No one can decide for you. This all depends on the quality of life which you are seeking for yourself and if you have a problem deep within yourself which attracts you to men who do not know how to love you in an honorable, honest, caring way, then by all means get help for that but please Sarah do not kid yourself into thinking that he has changed because people like him do not change this much in 6 months. They can't this sort of thing is way too ingrained by his age. We call men like this "crazy makers". They lure you in with charm and "Love talk" and then they begin the process of breaking you down with names and emotional neglect. Before you know it, you are beginning to question your own sanity and whether or not this is all your fault. This is all about manipulation and control. He keeps you down so that when he wants or needs something you jump higher and higher until your own self gets lost. A relationship where you become lost and question and second guess yourself is doomed from the start. He does not have it to give and you deserve so much better than this. I am glad that you are asking BEFORE you leap. Shows you are beginning to care for yourself. Love is not just a feeling. You say you love him and I am sure it feels very very strong and powerful. Love is also a decision. A decision to share yourself with a man who is right for you and your future happiness. Try to take some of the emotion out of this decision and look at the facts and use more of your head than your emotions right now and see what you come up with. This man takes away your power and that is not healthy, it not a good arrangement and eventually he will take you down far lower than you can ever know. Just read the stories on here about the women who married these guys and you can see that this does not get any better. This man has ALL the signs of being a bad boyfriend and a bad husband. I will keep you in my prayers while you are making this difficult decision. God bless, Goldie

I agree completely!! My exN promised he would go into therapy for 4 years and never did. I was assuming that at these kids young age he wouldn't even agree to it. Darlin, 23 is sooo young. You don't need to settle! There is someone out there that is wonderful and will see all of the wonderful things about you. You have your whole life ahead of you. There is no rush!!!

sarah, i totally agree with amy, you said he realy means it this time, how can you know that, just b/c he said it, he has changed, changed what? his personality, his ways, sarah, the bottom line is you want to go back with him, and you want valadation from someone, it wont be me love, you are 23 with your whole life ahead of you, not too old to have children not to old to become brand new. well iam, dont be me.

Here is a thought. If he truly loves you and really wants this to work tell him the only way you will do this is if you do joint couples therapy. In addition, this guy needs to take anger management classes and you should demand a report on his attendance and progress. I will bet he will say no to both and that will give you your answer.