Can they tell Lies from the truth?

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#1 Jun 23 - 8AM
trying2overcome
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Can they tell Lies from the truth?

This has probably already been addressed or talked about and I just havent read it yet so I apologize. What I question is can they even tell the difference between their lies and the truth or is he as clueless as he seems?? I swear I think my N "blocks" some of the things that he has done and said and truly believes it never happened. I called him out on the fact that he was conversing by text and phone with a woman he went out with once last summer during one of our week or 2 break ups .. we got back together and during our "togetherness" he was texting her daily. I know this because I became quite the CSI while we were together .. and bottom line is I KNOW he was and he SWEARS that he NEVER did that. That the only time he EVER talked to another woman was this last time when I broke up with him. (whatever) But he seems to have no real sense of time and situations. Days could be months or months days. He says and does things and then later he looks so confused and befuddled when I recount something that at times .. I really believe he is not lying but that he has actually buried the things he has done and TOTALLY believes what he is saying. Is this typical? I have had some experience with this because my Dad was physically abusive to my mother and we witnessed it but to this day he denies that he ever layed a hand on her. I truly believe it is a sickness and that in order to live with himself he had to block it out and he now believes it himself. Anyways, it is one of the many things that makes me crazy about my N .. funny he can remember anything I ever said or did but his actions are always fuzzy .... I just wonder if it is deception or has he truly decieved himself into thinking he never did or said certain things???

Jun 28 - 9AM
NinjaGirl
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Mine can't

He says he's always been brutally honest with people. Yet he breaks up with me very suddenly, all SIX times (I did a recount last night) after promising not to do so again, and certainly not without discussion. He also badmouths his "friends" behind their backs and tells them other things to their faces. I think in his mind he THINKS he's being honest, but he's not. And he used to get mad at me and call me mean when I actually stood up to people or confronted them. In fact, that was the cause of one of the six break ups. I stood up to a couple of people, and he called me mean. Ironic, since he's the psychopath.
Jun 28 - 8AM
imabloke
imabloke's picture

Lying

OMG I don't feel good today.. My exN is in a relationship with her boss that she has known for 13 yrs... he left his wife a few weeks ago. See my story: Q. What worse than a narcissist. A. An intelligent narcissist. While she was with me something was going on... but when did it start? I'm trying not to beat myself up over it but it hurts... I would have laid down my life for this woman.. I really trusted her and believed everything she said. God i feel so used. I mean really used. I don't know what to believe anymore what was truth what was lies I don't know. It casts a huge shadow over the 2.5 years we were together. It's just so cruel.
Jun 25 - 9AM
enoughalready
enoughalready's picture

lying

I was in la-la land the 4 out of 5 yrs we were together. I caught his lies in the beginning of our 5th year. The shocking part is thinking he lied the entire 5 yrs. As I read everyone's post, they all sound so alike I can't help but think I was conned and fooled. All those years I wasted loving a man who loved only himself, who lied and deceived me. I caught him in so many lies the 5th year, that every time I checked behind his back, I'd find something else-someone I never knew. I'm 46 and have been w/ a few men, men that were honest, loving,compassionate, kind w/ true integrity. Never dreamed I would love a man who didn't know anything about love. It was all fake, a facade. But in my heart, I loved him w/ every ounce of my being. It felt different, but never again will I ever love a man like that. He was just a big fat lie....and nothing else.
Jun 25 - 9AM (Reply to #36)
loveofmylife
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enoughalready

same as you...."i loved him with every ounce of my being". I told him once that "every cell of my body" was in love with him - that is exactly how it felt. I don't think it is possible to love someone more. I would have done anything for him. And I do feel like never again I would love someone like that. But is that all part of the "pathological" draw? The kind of charisma that cult leaders have that drive people to suicide? Is is just a milder version of that? Everyone in my life has been telling me to get away from this guy...just like they would tell you to get away from a cult leader. But I don't see it... I think that because they don't know him, they don't get it. So why can others see it, but I can't? And I'm a pretty smart girl.... And don't you find it hard to accept that we could have loved someone so fully and completely and thought they absolutely loved us back fully and completely? How are they so good at faking it? I'm a pretty good judge of character....so how could I have been so completely fooled for decades? How can someone "act" in love? It is mind boggling to me. And I think the saddest part for me is to realize that 1/2 my life was consumed with loving someone who only pretended to love me back. What a waste of all of that emotional energy.
Jun 25 - 2PM (Reply to #37)
Monica
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Loveofmylife..I have been asking myself the same questions

I was just thinking in the last day or two how I will never love someone as much ever again. It's all in them being masters of seeing our vulnerabilities, where our "needs" are the greatest and then targeting them. They ARE Mr. Wonderful for a time! Treat us like gold, like the most important "things" (lol!) in their entire lives, past, present and future. They brainwash us so thoroughly that, even when the mask comes off and they show their true selves, we don't see it, we don't hear it, we don't believe it. Our brain chemistry has been altered and we don't see what is right in front of our noses. And they are great actors. Acting "in love" is just one of their talents in the acting field. It is very easy for them to "act in love" because they are always acting. Always. This is probably the hardest thing that most of us have ever been through in our entire lives. Few other things compare, at least in my own life.
Jun 24 - 11AM
herlatestvictim
herlatestvictim's picture

mentally ill, pathological liars!

My N would deny speaking to OW... yet when I went through emails, I found that my N was speaking to the OW on that same day and emailing us the exact same loving words only minutes apart! My N would also say that she couldn't lie. Was a bad liar... yeah right!!! That too was a LIE. If their mouths are moving, they are lying. I believe that they think they are SO GOOD that can fool us all into believing their lies.
Jun 28 - 1PM (Reply to #31)
broken23
broken23's picture

i found the exact

i found the exact same...same emails, different women! when i confronted him...he said well i call everyone honey i call you baby. yup that was his explanation...and still denied it!! until i talked to the girl myself...ofcourse he was with her. i have learned it they are master liars...they might believe their lie in the moment and convince them of something...but more so i think they want to see how far they can push somone and have no boundaries. i have also seen that his behavior made me lose my sanity...i have no idea why i wanted to believe him even though the story was ridiculous...i think because he said it with such conviction. however, i would become quite the detective...and the truth never was what he said!
Jun 28 - 1PM (Reply to #32)
rainbow1
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After the first time we got

After the first time we got back together I looked through his computer too. I saw that he sent many girls MySpace messages that were the same. I also found dirty sex sites that he joined (but denied). When I looked through his work cell phone I saw texts between him and one of the girls he was with when we broke up. It was like dejevu! He said the exact same things to her word for word that he said to me in the beginning of our relationship! It was creepy. After we got back together she and one of her friends tried contacting me because they said they HAD to get the truth out about him. I refused to listen to what they had to say. I regret that every single day of my life. I have tried hunting her down to see if she still wants to tell me a year later. I hope I find her!

_______________________________________________
"dont let yesterday take up too much of today"

Jun 28 - 1PM (Reply to #33)
broken23
broken23's picture

i know i am kicking myself

i know i am kicking myself for not being friends with his ex. i want to know what she had to say...i know where she is but i am a little afraid of contacting her bc she plays the "i still want to be friends" with him. yet i know when they broke up she said he needs help.
Jun 28 - 1PM (Reply to #34)
rainbow1
rainbow1's picture

The ex that he always tries

The ex that he always tries to run back to but she doesnt let him asked a mutual friend of ours the other day if I would go to a movie with her. I was busy that day, but wish that I would of. I want to contact her, but I am scared to do so. I dont want to look crazy, but if she asked if I would go with her then I wouldnt look that crazy would I? I know the N would just freak out if he heard that we saw each other! He does a good job at dating in different social groups so that his exes never have to meet.

_______________________________________________
"dont let yesterday take up too much of today"

Jun 25 - 12AM (Reply to #30)
loveofmylife
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email yuck

I found that too, interweaving emails in the same day to different women flattering all of them and seemingly pursuing relationships with several in a single day. I still have not been able to wrap my head around that one. I've been meaning to take a "time out" to think about what that really means...what it would be like to be simultaneously luring more than one person in a single day....especially when you are 50! omg.... it is so beyond my comprehesion...that I feel like this is the one thing I really need to meditate on and to understand to put the final nail in the coffin! And yes, when I confronted him to his face about, he lied - it was 100% believable. Scary stuff.
Jun 24 - 9AM
secondchance
secondchance's picture

lying

mine would say "it was the truth to me!" the therapist had to repeatedly remind him that didn't make it the truth. so crazy.
Jun 24 - 5AM
TNR1
TNR1's picture

This baffled me...

Mr. N would always say that he wished he could lie, but that he couldn't. Yet he lied when I first met him. I don't think any of us who have the ability to care can fully appreciate what lack of empathy allows a person to do or believe.
Jun 24 - 3AM
Scoop
Scoop's picture

Mine was so split that there

Mine was so split that there where 2 compleatly diffrent people in him ,one oblivious of the other. He would say the most outragious things when i reminded him of them he looked baffled . it was baffiling because when the good guy in him was out to play this man could never say thoses thing . You know i had read about multiple personality syndrome but i never really thought it exsisted so blatantly in a person , i thought it was just for the movies . It is impossible to live with .Wow these guys are messed up .
Jun 24 - 11AM (Reply to #26)
betty2020
betty2020's picture

Scoop i think mine has

Scoop i think mine has multiply personality disorders. There were many times he would say things so off the wall that i was baffled. Then when confronting him he would either say it never was said or justify it with some stupid excuse. I think mine definitely has MPD

only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

Jun 23 - 9PM
sher1221
sher1221's picture

I swear I don't know

I swear I don't know. My Narc and I also had a cell phone issue a couple of years ago. He was talking it up with some chick he worked with got caught supposedly stopped talking to her. Then I tracked it online. I came home with printout of convos that day confronted him (he didn't know about printout or online tracking) Looked me square in the eyes and denied talking to her that day.... Was a very chilling and revealing moment of our relationship... What did he do when I threw the papers in his damn face.... Got pissed at me for catching his cheating ass....I swear I don't know if they believe their lies or not!!!
Jun 23 - 6PM
tasha
tasha's picture

hey

I read this somewhere on this site-they're lies are their truth. They believe everything that they say is 'gods honest truth'. I read Babrabara quote-if their lips are moving, they are lying. which is so true!!
Jun 23 - 9AM
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

trying2overcome

They are DELUSIONAL, which Webster defines as: a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary. So yes, I believe they believe their lies. They live in a fantasy world of their own making. He is deceiving himself!
Jun 23 - 10AM (Reply to #4)
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

Great article on delusions

Interesting article points out: The narcissist consciously chooses to adopt one version of events, an aggrandizing narrative, a fairy-tale existence, a "what-if" counterfactual life. He is emotionally invested in his personal myth. The narcissist feels better as fiction than as fact - but he never loses sight of the fact that it is all just fiction. Psychosis & Delusions One of the most important symptoms of pathological narcissism (the Narcissistic Personality Disorder) is grandiosity. Grandiose fantasies (megalomaniac delusions of grandeur) permeate every aspect of the narcissist's personality. They are the reason that the narcissist feels entitled to special treatment which is typically incommensurate with his real accomplishments. The grandiosity gap is the abyss between the narcissist's self-image (as reified by his False Self) and reality. When narcissistic supply is deficient, the narcissist decompensates and acts out in a variety of ways. Narcissists often experience psychotic micro-episodes during therapy and when they suffer narcissistic injuries in a life crisis. But can the narcissist "go over the edge"? Do narcissists ever become psychotic? Some terminology first: The narrowest definition of psychosis, according to the DSM-IV-TR, is "restricted to delusions or prominent hallucinations, with the hallucinations occurring in the absence of insight into their pathological nature". And what are delusions and hallucinations? A delusion is "a false belief based on incorrect inference about external reality that is firmly sustained despite what almost everyone else believes and despite what constitutes incontrovertible and obvious proof or evidence to the contrary." A hallucination is a "sensory perception that has the compelling sense of reality of a true perception but that occurs without external stimulation of the relevant sensory organ." Granted, the narcissist's hold on reality is tenuous (narcissists sometimes fail the reality test). Admittedly, narcissists often seem to believe in their own confabulations. They are unaware of the pathological nature and origin of their self-delusions and are, thus, technically delusional (though they rarely suffer from hallucinations, disorganized speech, or disorganized or catatonic behaviour). In the strictest sense of the word, narcissists appear to be psychotic. But, actually, they are not. There is a qualitative difference between benign (though well-entrenched) self-deception or even malignant con-artistry - and "losing it". Pathological narcissism should not be construed as a form of psychosis because: 1. The narcissists is usually fully aware of the difference between true and false, real and make-belief, the invented and the extant, right and wrong. The narcissist consciously chooses to adopt one version of the events, an aggrandizing narrative, a fairy-tale existence, a "what-if" counterfactual life. He is emotionally invested in his personal myth. The narcissist feels better as fiction than as fact - but he never loses sight of the fact that it is all just fiction. 2. Throughout, the narcissist is in full control of his faculties, cognizant of his choices, and goal-orientated. His behaviour is intentional and directional. He is a manipulator and his delusions are in the service of his stratagems. Hence his chameleon-like ability to change guises, his conduct, and his convictions on a dime. 3. Narcissistic delusions rarely persist in the face of blanket opposition and reams of evidence to the contrary. The narcissist usually tries to convert his social milieu to his point of view. He attempts to condition his nearest and dearest to positively reinforce his delusional False Self. But, if he fails, he modifies his profile on the fly. He "plays it by ear". His False Self is extemporaneous - a perpetual work of art, permanently reconstructed in a reiterative process designed around intricate and complex feedback loops. Though the narcissistic personality is rigid - its content is always in flux. Narcissists forever re-invent themselves, adapt their consumption of narcissistic supply to the "marketplace", attuned to the needs of their "suppliers". Like the performers that they are, they resonate with their "audience", giving it what it expects and wants. They are efficient instruments for the extraction and consumption of human reactions. As a result of this interminable process of fine tuning, narcissists have no loyalties, no values, no doctrines, no beliefs, no affiliations, and no convictions. Their only constraint is their addiction to human attention, positive or negative. Psychotics, by comparison, are fixated on a certain view of the world and of their place in it. They ignore any and all information that might challenge their delusions. Gradually, they retreat into the inner recesses of their tormented mind and become dysfunctional. Narcissists can't afford to shut out the world because they so heavily depend on it for the regulation of their labile sense of self-worth. Owing to this dependence, they are hypersensitive and hypervigilant, alert to every bit of new data. They are continuously busy rearranging their self-delusions to incorporate new information in an ego-syntonic manner. This is why the Narcissistic Personality Disorder is insufficient grounds for claiming a "diminished capacity" (insanity) defense. Narcissists are never divorced from reality - they crave it, and need it, and consume it in order to maintain the precarious balance of their disorganized, borderline-psychotic personality. All narcissists, even the freakiest ones, can tell right from wrong, act with intent, and are in full control of their faculties and actions. by Sam Vaknin http://samvak.tripod.com/
Jun 23 - 11PM (Reply to #8)
girlfriday
girlfriday's picture

Great article

Does this mean that SV is no longer banned from this website? Is Lovefraud still banned? I'm not being cute. I really want to know. My exN told me that he believes his lies as he's telling them...but I'm not sure I believe him ;-) Mine could lie to my face even if I was holding up proof that he was lying. I think that for some of them it's a game. He was so convincing. I remember telling him, "Either you're lying to me, or I am paranoid schizophrenic." I meant it too. There was no in between. It was either/or. But he was sooooo convincing that he was NOT lying, so that's when I started questioning my own reality. What I later learned is called gaslighting. Mine also created various realities and compartmentalized them from each other. My point? They just lie. Doesn't matter if you have proof. They live a lie.
Jun 24 - 7AM (Reply to #21)
loveofmylife
loveofmylife's picture

Same here

They are definitely cut from the same cloth. When I suspected he was lying to me...i had hard evidence that he was dating - I saw it with my own eyes! When asked about it innocently, he lied straight to my face. It was elaborate and had no indication of being a lie. This happened several times. He lied to many people about many things, as I found out. It was like he was living in his own reality and he was concocting a unique reality for each woman he was involved with - special just for them. And it was done with such genuine conviction - it was impossible to tell they were lies. And he takes such great pride in his "virtue" and talks about it all the time - how he makes the "right" choices and therefore is one to be followed. He made me believe that I was the crazy one (gaslighting as you say), questioning my own reality. Wow - maybe I did misinterpret every interaction we have had in 20 years. It is why they call it crazy making......something I've never experienced with anyone else in my life. And yes, he has various realities and compartmentalizes these realities from eachother. It is like separate little plays going on in his life with completely different cast of characters in each play. Its like kids who wont let any of their food touch on their plate. And like in Seinfeld, he would have major issues if any of his worlds collided. It must keep them so nervous and on their toes to keep all of their lives separate. Or actually, maybe this is just thrilling for them - the challenge of keeping their lives separate.
Jun 28 - 1AM (Reply to #22)
girlfriday
girlfriday's picture

loveofmylife

Keep them nervous? No. It's a thrill ride. As I've mentioned before, mine said to me, "I like to see how much I can get away with." I believe that it's like a hit of crack every time my ex pulls something off. The longer he could keep up the game, the better.
Jun 24 - 2AM (Reply to #9)
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

Correct, SV is no longer banned from this site

That's correct. Sam Vaknin posts are no longer banned from this site. This is something that Barbara insisted on and as moderator, I allowed her this liberty. I had my ex-husband sign a waiver so I could include the poetry he wrote me in my book. Why? Because I believe that his poetry gives incredible insight into the mind of a narcissist. I believe Sam Vaknin, as a self-professed narcissist, also provides us with a unique viewpoint that we should not ignore in our attempts to understand what makes a narcissist tick.
Jun 24 - 11AM (Reply to #20)
betty2020
betty2020's picture

I couldn't agree more

I couldn't agree more

only one way to go...Forward (tm?)

Jun 24 - 11AM (Reply to #15)
GIJ
GIJ's picture

Speaking of poetry and insight

I keep hearing this John Mayer song on the radio. It sounds pleasant enough until you really hear what he is singing: Half of My Heart I was born in the arms of imaginary friends Free to roam, made a home out of everywhere I've been Then you come crashing in, like the realest thing Trying my best to understand all that your love can bring Oh half of my heart's got a grip on the situation Half of my heart takes time Half of my heart's got a right mind to tell you That I can't keep loving you Oh, with half of my heart I was made to believe i'd never love somebody else I made a plan, stay the man who can only love himself Lonely was the song I sang, 'til the day you came Showing me a better way and all that my love can bring Oh half of my heart's got a grip on the situation Half of my heart takes time Half of my heart's got a right mind to tell you That I can't keep loving you Oh, with half of my heart With half of my heart Your faith is strong But I can only fall short for so long Time will hold, later on You will hate that I never gave more to you than half of my heart But I can't stop loving you But I can't stop loving you But I can't stop loving you with half of my... Half of my heart Half of my heart Half of my heart's got a real good imagination Half of my heart's got you Half of my heart's got a right mind to tell you That half of my heart won't do Half of my heart is a shotgun wedding to a bride with a paper ring And half of my heart is the part of a man who's never really loved anything Half of my heart Half of my heart Half of my heart Half of my heart Half of my heart Half of my heart
Jun 24 - 11AM (Reply to #16)
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

GIJ

Great post! John Mayer is a raging narcissist! Did you hear what he told Playboy magazine? Not only did he give details of his sex life with Jennifer Aniston and Jessica Simpson, but he stated that he would rather masturbate than be with a woman. No joke! Here's an article on it. Self Love by Melinda Tankard Reist In an interview in this month's Playboy, John Mayer says he can't keep his hands off himself. Giving new meaning to narcissism, Mayer says he prefers an intimate night in with his computer to a night out with a real live woman. Even when he's with a real woman, Mayer confesses he is just using her as a masturbatory aid while porn images and stories run through his head. To Mayer, women are only a means to an end: his own, self-assisted, big bang. Here's an extract: MAYER: ...pornography? It's a new synaptic pathway. You wake up in the morning, open a thumbnail page, and it leads to a Pandora's box of visuals. There have probably been days when I saw 300 [naked girls] before I got out of bed. PLAYBOY: What's your point about porn and relationships? MAYER: Internet pornography has absolutely changed my generation's expectations. How could you be constantly synthesizing an orgasm based on dozens of shots? You're looking for the one photo out of 100 you swear is going to be the one you finish to, and you still don't finish. Twenty seconds ago you thought that photo was the hottest thing you ever saw, but you throw it back and continue your shot hunt and continue to make yourself late for work. How does that (porn) not affect the psychology of having a relationship with somebody? It's got to. PLAYBOY: You seem very fond of pornography. MAYER: When I watch porn, if it's not hot enough, I'll make up backstories in my mind. My biggest dream is to write pornography. PLAYBOY: Masturbation for you is as good as sex? MAYER: Absolutely, because during sex, I'm just going to run a filmstrip. I'm still masturbating. That's what you do when you're 30, 31, 32. This is my problem now: Rather than meet somebody new, I would rather go home and replay the amazing experiences I've already had. PLAYBOY: You'd rather jerk off to an ex-girlfriend than meet someone new? MAYER: Yeah. What that explains is that I'm more comfortable in my imagination than I am in actual human discovery. The best days of my life are when I've dreamed about a sexual encounter with someone I've already been with. When that happens, I cannot lay off myself. It wasn't only his sexism, Mayer revealed. His penis was "white supremacist", like "David Duke" because it didn't get up for black women, he said. He did find some black women hot, but that's because the ones who turned him on were more like blonde white women. Mayer's ode to self-love shows how pornography has influenced his attitudes to women. Impatient with women in the flesh, he has turned to the image of a woman for his habitual computer sex. Porn is shaping the thinking of younger boys as well. Boys who watch porn are more likely to think sexual harassment is acceptable and less likely to form successful relationships when they're older, according to Australian researcher Michael Flood. Flood's latest research, while reported overseas, has had little mention in Australia's mainstream media. The report, 'Harms of Pornography Exposure Among Children and Young People', also found that boys who see porn are more inclined to believe there is nothing wrong with pinning down or sexually harassing a girl. "Exposure to pornography helps to sustain young people's adherence to sexist and unhealthy notions of sex and relationships", says Flood. In the UK last week, porn's troubling influence on boys was given significant attention in a Daily Mail piece, 'Teenage boys watching hours of internet pornography a week treating girlfriends like sex objects'. Girls spoke about taking chaperones ('3rd wheels') with them on dates to try to rein in the sexually aggressive behaviour of boys. Boys called them bitches and demanded they act like porn stars. But not all men want to act like that. Oliver, from Queensland, just wrote to me about porn's effect on him: "I have struggled with pornography for a long time and I hate it. I hate what it does to my mind and my perception of women. I hate how it can consume my thoughts. I hate the fact that I constantly fight to keep my mind free from it and I will have to fight for the rest of my life. I also hate the fact that it is almost impossible for a young man to grow up without having this perversion shoved in his face...We have a very screwed up view of masculinity and what a 'real' man looks like..." Mayer might think the only risk to himself is Repetitive Strain Injury. But he is risking real relationships with real women in the real world, because he is entirely oriented toward seeing them as his personal ejaculatory helpers. Unlike images, real women touch, and speak back. Real women are complex and messy and difficult. That's why loving a woman, like loving a man, is a communion rather than looking in a mirror. Mayer's ode to narcissism also means he has forfeited the pleasures of love. Any woman with a brain or a heart would run a mile from the singer with the calloused hands. Mayer's public act of pornography product placement contributes to the dominant cultural script that girls and women -whether computer-generated or real - are merely in the world as pleasure centres for men, that they are to be targeted for porn-inspired acts, and that they have no place or existence outside these roles. Melinda Tankard Reist is editor of Getting Real: Challenging the sexualisation of girls (Spinifex Press, 2009) and a founder of Collective Shout: for a world free of sexploitation (www.collectiveshout.org). http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/stories/s2848775.htm
Jun 24 - 1PM (Reply to #19)
trying2overcome
trying2overcome's picture

WOW !!

WOW .. I actually like his music and I have the CD that 1/2 my heart is on .. and there a re a couple of songs on there that resonate for me. One is "All we do is say Goodbye" And it says something like As soon as I get you off my mind, your voice comes thrashing wildly thru my quiet bed, You say you want to work it out but I have tried everything but giving in. Why do you want to break my heart again, and why would I let you try .. when all we ever do is say goodbye! That was my relationship with my N in a nutshell. I try to block him out .. and here he comes again .. and all we ever did was say goodbye .. sometimes weekly!!! yuk I am grossed out by what John M said in that interview. What scares me most .. is the more guys I see meet and hear about .. the more of this pattern I see and they are all so consumed with porn and images. I wonder if I will ever find a nice normal guy ... I thought I did with the N .. boy was I off the mark!!!
Jun 24 - 12PM (Reply to #17)
GIJ
GIJ's picture

He is soo gross

I remember posting lyrics to another song of his a while back and Barbara posted a link to this article. I nearly fell off my chair! I was just learning about the porn connection at that time. My narc told me early on he rarely sleeps. And I also realized he has a wall of mirror in his bedroom and also one directly next to his desk and computer. Ironically, he recently expressed concerns for porn addicts (interesting). Mine is a business connection and not a "romantic" one. So thankfully I have been spared what all of you have endured. It is heartbreaking to read how demeaning they can be in the bedroom, amongst other things. Yet, here John Mayer is setting this horrific example to thousands who don't get it and making money hand over fist. I'm so glad Oprah wouldn't give him a platform on her show and stood by her friends on this one.
Jun 24 - 4PM (Reply to #18)
Lisa E. Scott
Lisa E. Scott's picture

Yep

Isn't he gross? John Mayer, that is? Such a horrible example for our youth. I'm glad Oprah didn't have him on either. He makes my skin crawl. To brag about not being able to keep your hands off yourself is sick and twisted.
Jun 24 - 8AM (Reply to #11)
AnotherPath
AnotherPath's picture

I totally agree. I read so

I totally agree. I read so much of his stuff on the web especially early on, for over a year. He seemed to answer all the thoughts and questions I had about narcissism and what goes on in their heads and why they do it, coming from a narc/psychopath I found this invaluable. Ok I'd like to mention another person who was banned to read about, although there was no explanation as to why. Her name is Kaleah LaRoche her writings from Web of Illusion really helped me and she talks a lot about healing which is the way forward from all this.

Ending the dance