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Do I answer N's calls???

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#1 Sep 30 - 7PM
Anonymous (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Do I answer N's calls???

The N is calling for my daughter. I can't stand for him to call her because he gets her so upset. She starts crying and tells him how much he misses her and then...doesn't call again for days or weeks. What do I do???

Oct 2 - 9PM
Carolyn
Carolyn's picture

Disturbing the harmony of

Disturbing the harmony of your household is his game. you and your daughter need to talk about his problems and to develop a strategy to cope with him.
Sep 30 - 10PM
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

NanC

no more calls!!!! voicemail. I'm 100% with grossot here: 'Daughter's busy. She can't talk right now.' He does not deserve an explanation. If he asks to have her call him say no. He does not get a reason. Don't tell daughter he called. The only reason I'm saying this is because it hurts her every time he doesn't call IMHO its just better that she thinks he never calls to decrease her confusion. And get her into COUNSELING IMMEDIATELY!!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Pathologicals only discard the best, most precious of gems of people... not the worst. They despise the strong, principled, decent & honest. Their discarding of you is then their highest commendation of your worth!" - A.V.
Sep 30 - 7PM
NanC (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Well...

I guess I didn't see yall's entry fast enough. I told her he called and asked her if she wanted to talk to him. (I guess I was feeling guilty of keeping her from him). She said yes and guess what? It went straight to voicemail! What an asshole! He's probably on the phone with his gf or probably feels like "Oh well, I've done my part of attempting to contact her". He is the most pathetic father I have ever known! He's suppose to get her this weekend...(barf!) Hopefully, he'll bail out like he usually does. Anybody want to share their experience with exN and kids spending time with them?
Oct 1 - 6PM (Reply to #5)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

A Set Schedule

When I went through what you're going through now, there was a "Mediator" through the court system who helped decide what visitation and call schedule we were to follow. Ours was: Every Wednesday night at 8:00 PM, daughter would call N. If he didn't pick up, "oh well"....that was that. He was NOT allowed to call us. I had a restraining order against him due to all his violent threats and erratic behavior. I had documented EVERYTHING so that I could get the courts to see what I was dealing with. The visitation schedule was: Monitored visits every other Saturday for three hours. The monitor was either someone we both agreed on (it certainly wasn't ME) or a court appointed one that HE would have to pay for. He was very difficult to deal with. His histrionics and crying and pouting and blame shifting and temper tantrums were awful. He would spend most of his visitation time complaining to the monitor about me. He would cause all kinds of drama so that my daughter would end up calling me crying, "Come and get me, Mama!". It was a nightmare but I stuck to my guns and didn't waver from the set schedule. If he didn't pick up the phone when he KNEW it was time for the Wednesday night call, he would throw a FIT but that was too bad. He had to learn that he wasn't going to control this situation. I was. It was apparent that I would have to come up with a plan so that when the scheduled visits arrived, I had a backup plan for when he pulled his angry, crying accusation stuff and basically scared my daughter to tears. SO, what I did was scope out the visitation area (usually it was at a park or maybe the mall) and take my daughter there about a half an hour BEFORE the scheduled meeting time. Then, I would show her a place that I would be (hidden from where they would be but a place she would know how to get to). I would then meet him like we had just arrived. Then, I would say "Goodbye" and go to the Secret Place. I would read or people watch until the appointed time was up. If he pulled anything, my daughter could just leave him and walk to where I was. It worked perfectly. She felt safe knowing that Mama was right there waiting at the Secret Place the whole time! Eventually, once N knew he couldn't get away with anything, he did settle down SOMEWHAT. However, he was always a loose cannon and I never knew when he was gonna blow. It was stressful but I never let my guard down. I hope you can have some formal schedule in place so you can monitor the HECK out of his interactions with your daughter. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING! neveragain
Oct 1 - 10PM (Reply to #12)
NanC (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Did your daughter ever...

Act up & say hurtful things to you? Tonite, my 6 yr old daughter told me she wanted her daddy & that he's the one that buys her everything. He doesn't buy her crap! She was just trying to get me mad. She was tired & fussy (fell asleep right away) but i know she's missing him. I almost gave in & called him but i remembered what you all said, "don't give in" so i didn't. Last nite when i messed up & let her call him back & it went to voicemail she said, "daddy i love u & i hope you're ok". I thot for sure he'd call her today but he didn't! It was even his Thursday to get her from 6-8 & didn't even call. This is his weekend (hope he pulls a no show). I'm going to start printing my cellphone bill so i can have proof of the few times he's called & claims he can't get her cause i don't answer the phone. Easy cop out for him...
Oct 1 - 10PM (Reply to #13)
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

NanC

and start keep track of your daughter's acting out and journal everything he says and does (or doesn't do) Take that with you to court too! Get your daughter into therapy IMMEDIATELY. ~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Pathologicals only discard the best, most precious of gems of people... not the worst. They despise the strong, principled, decent & honest. Their discarding of you is then their highest commendation of your worth!" - A.V.
Oct 2 - 7PM (Reply to #14)
NanC (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Barbara & Neveragain

I am currently lookin for a counselor for the little one. Let me give u more insight on my life. My husband is wonderful with her, she has the stability of having a father in her life that calls her princess & treats her as his very own. (she's even asked if she could change her name so it will be like everyone else in the family). Do you think she needs counseling or am i going to confuse her by taking her to counseling. As far as she can remember, the N has always been in & out of her life. He's always worked out of town so she never got use to him really living with us. She does fine as long as he stays away! Last nite, had visitations 6-8, no call no show, this wkend was his wkend & was suppose to get at 6, again didn't even call. It would seem like the fathers & worthless mothers have more rights than the kids. The parents can ditch the kids but the kids are forced to see the loser parent! Does a counselor explain to the kids about their parents' absence or do they just let the kids tell them hoe they feel? I've never been to counseling so i have no clue.
Oct 2 - 9PM (Reply to #16)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

Focus Focus Focus

Even if you are questioning the validity of counseling, it can only help this situation that your daughter is in. SHE needs to have some stability. That STABILITY can only come from a set schedule that you're involved in enforcing. You have to remain calm, focused and confident when it comes to ANYTHING regarding the N. In the courts, the "fathers & worthless mothers" DO have more rights. HOWEVER, if you document everything and then go back to court to request a set schedule, you have a chance in making a difference. A counselor is PRICELESS in this process. Their letters, affidavits, recorded sessions with your daughter will be very effective in a ruling that will force the N to abide by the courts decision. You have way more influence here than you know. DON'T GIVE UP. FOCUS. Get counseling for her and you. neveragain
Oct 2 - 7PM (Reply to #15)
Barbara (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

she needs counseling AND SO DO YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Talk to her Pediatrician and get a referral to a counselor immediately. IMMEDIATELY. It will help her a LOT!!!!!! Second - find a PTSD trauma counselor for you IMMEDIATELY!!!!! http://www.sidran.org/sub.cfm?sectionID=5 DO NOT HESITATE. Do this IMMEDIATELY! ~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Pathologicals only discard the best, most precious of gems of people... not the worst. They despise the strong, principled, decent & honest. Their discarding of you is then their highest commendation of your worth!" - A.V.
Oct 1 - 7PM (Reply to #6)
grossot
grossot's picture

neveragain

I like your idea of the Secret Place. Sounds like you really played your cards right. Did you have any support then? How did you come up with the idea for the Secret Place? I can tell you are an awesome 'Momma'. Your daughter is blessed to have you. Is she an adult now? (Forgive me I forget how long ago your story took place). If so how did she turn out? What does she think about her dad now? Sorry for all the questions but I'm trying to gain a little insight on my daughters future perspective of her N father. She's only 5 and already being used. ~Give a Narc an inch and they become the ruler~ nolongercontrolled

http://hubpages.com/hub/Married-to-a-Narcissist?preview

nolongercontrolled

Oct 1 - 8PM (Reply to #7)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

I Was Flyin' By the Seat of My PANTS!

Actually, I must say, "thank you" for asking me all those questions. My daughter was six when I left her Dad. He had many problems and looking back, he was a HUGE Narcissist and I did the absolute best thing for my daughter and myself by leaving. The leaving process (as is typical with these guys) was a stop/start deal. He ALWAYS roped me back in with promises and sweet talk. I felt HORRIBLY guilty for "taking his daughter away" but honestly, it was truly for the best. I had some support in my family and I had/have (still see her when necc.) a great therapist. I didn't have any money for an attorney but found an "Attorney Assisted Legal Center" that had a super-sharp paralegal who walked me through everything. I ended up paying about $1,000.00 for the WHOLE thing. :) I was scared to death because my ex-N repeatedly threatened me. He threatened my life, told me he had a gun, told me he knew where I lived and where daughter went to school, etc. He had a nasty drug habit, would get high and come threaten me physcially if I didn't give him all my money. He wiped me out financially....took everything out of our account. He stole my wedding china and wedding silver and took it to his dealer for drugs. He took our stereo, radios, his electric razor, the microwave, anything worth money and traded it in for drugs. It was pretty bad. I had to have a plan. When I left at first, I moved to a tiny, furnished one bedroom that had two twin beds. I was TRYING to still let her father see her and hadn't filed for divorce....yet. After a few months, it was quite obvious that I wasn't dealing with a normal person. He was pathological to the point where one day, I caught him blowing crack smoke into my parakeets cage....stuff like that. I won't go into ALL the details but I will tell you that he checked himself into a rehab (I knew he was just doing it to manipulate me) where they called me to inform me that I was a "co-dependent" and "just as sick as he is". So, to do "the right thing" I went to their STUPID meetings 3 times a week. When he got out and started using again I knew I could make my break for it. This was six months after I had originally left. I moved so he wouldn't know where I was. I filed for divorce. It became easier after that because I had documented EVERYTHING. I was able to go to court and the judge ruled everything in my favor. The courts set up the schedule for visitation and phone calls and awarded me $275.00 a month child support. I didn't get any child support from him for 10 years. Finally, I reported him to the District Attorney's office and they garnished his wages. He has just NOW (like one month ago) finally finished paying all the back child support. My daughter is 25. My daugher is doing absolutely GREAT. I never said anything bad about her Dad (I didn't have to). After the first few years, she started having her own opinion about him. I have a letter she wrote when she was 10.....it says it ALL. "How many times are you going to promise me things? How many times are you going to mess up?" I just now looked at my files. I have tapes of therapy sessions with my daughter. Tapes of nasty voicemail messages he left on my phone AND my families phones. I have diaries of dates and times of abuse. I have photographs of where he hit me. I have affidavits and letters from therapists and family members who dealt with him. I left no stone unturned. Every day, I would walk out of my office (I work in a guarded building so I felt safe INSIDE) knowing that I might take a bullet. I had to put that aside and just keep doing the right thing. If I died trying, well so be it. My daughter is happily married to the man of her dreams. Her Dad did walk her down the isle and even though he tried to make the wedding all about him (even asking me back....gag!) it was a gorgeous wedding. My daughter turned out very well adjusted and very well educated. I sometimes worked two jobs to do it but it was all worth it. She's happy, talented, smart, funny, compassionate and very beautiful. She did tell me when she was getting ready to move across the country, "You know, Mom, I'm kind of glad I'm moving away from that relationship (meaning her Dad). I just can't be responsible for him anymore". I told her that she isn't now and never was. We're very, very close and have a lot to be grateful for. I hope some of that helps answer your questions. I hope that we can all find a safe place for ourselves and our children. neveragain
Oct 2 - 7PM (Reply to #10)
James (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Thanks so much for sharing!

Yes, each of us can and must be the “life -line” and stability in our children’s life. They need us more then ever and we must be there for them time and time again. Children from families like these will need extra care and patience from us. They need a “safe place” and we must give it to them and assure them it will always be there for them! So that after awhile they too will see how dysfunctional and unstable the other parent is and will bond with the one that teaches them truth and love! Give them what they need the most which is love and stability and like flowers in a field watered and given sunlight, watch them grow up and become what God intended them to be! Loving healthy stable people who we can be proud of!
Oct 2 - 9PM (Reply to #11)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

Thanks, James

You gave me goose bumps! How true it is that we do have the power to have an important impact on truth in our childrens lives. It's easy to lose sight of that and hard to always know....since the chaos is so disturbing...but it's true. Very true. I think it's a matter of focusing on the goal of providing a steady source of comfort to them. Hugs, neveragain
Oct 1 - 10PM (Reply to #8)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

I Just Want To Add:

You know, kids are smart. They're intuitive. My daughter knew there was something terribly wrong with her father and that he made Mommy cry. While I was dealing with him, it was like having TWO kids. Only one of them was able to control my money. When someone controls your money, they control you. What I thought would be the best thing for my daughter was to always try to stay calm, focused and, well, happy. She had enough drama from her dad and I tried very hard to shield her from any overly demonstrative pain that I was going through. I realized that she was a CHILD and she was already feeling responsible for her FATHER's feelings. So, I made sure she did not feel responsible for ME. I made things as NORMAL as I possibly could. Night time stories and prayers. Macaroni and cheese dinners and Mom and Daughter nights. I tried very hard to alleviate her fears. I did this by acting as upbeat, positive, confident and NORMAL as possible. I shielded her from most of the brutal details. I only told her recently about those details....like, three weeks ago. It is not a child's responsibility to fix anything. They deserve to have a childhood. I tried to give my daughter the best childhood I could. I couldn't possibly shield her from everything. However, I think she's turned out beautifully. She's wise and kind....but she doesn't take being manipulated by anyone. She ended up seeing my therapist as her therapist for many years. So, my therapist knows our history quite well. I started seeing my therapist when my daughter was four so, that's 21 years. Staying calm is a major factor in saving your children from trauma. To stay calm, you have to really focus on the truth. No amount of talking or histrionics or blame shifting changes the truth. I read a lot of Psalms during that time. It was comforting and I knew that God would help me find a safe harbor. I wish I had the resources that are available now when I was going through that dark time. I wish I had been able to logon here and get advice, support and information. I felt so alone then. It was hard but looking back, I think both my daughter and I did okay. neveragain
Oct 1 - 10PM (Reply to #9)
neveragain
neveragain's picture

Oh, And One More Thing:

My daughter, just a few weeks ago, said this: "MOM, HE'S TWELVE!" He's actually 52. His credit is so bad, he can't qualify to get an APARTMENT. (rolling my eyes here) neveragain
Sep 30 - 7PM (Reply to #4)
Beachcolors
Beachcolors's picture

Awful

That is just awful....what a dick!
Sep 30 - 7PM
grossot
grossot's picture

Daughter's busy. She can't

Daughter's busy. She can't talk right now. He does not deserve an expalaination. If he asks to have her call him say no. He does not get a reason. Don't tell daughter he called. The only reason I'm saying this is because it hurts her every time he doesn't call IMHO its just better that she thinks he never calls to decrease her confusion. Unfortunately, with these people, things get turned around backwards and its just best to have a predictable situation. If he called every night at 7, for example, that would be different atprovided he doesn't upset her. I'm starting to see this on again off again pattern with my N towards his daughter and I'm going to stop it before she catches on. Best of luck:) (((((Hug)))))) ~Give a Narc an inch and they become the ruler~ nolongercontrolled

http://hubpages.com/hub/Married-to-a-Narcissist?preview

nolongercontrolled

Sep 30 - 7PM
Beachcolors
Beachcolors's picture

IDK!

Wow....i don't know what I would do. On one hand you can't keep him from talking to his daughter but on the other he can't do this to a child. Maybe keep a log of each phone call and ask for limitations in court. What do you think?