The MESSAGE in emotions.

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#1 Sep 27 - 10PM
NancyM
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The MESSAGE in emotions.

Healing from Narc poisoning, as we all know, in a long drawn out, painful, difficult process. There is no escaping any of those roller coaster trips, as is often said on these boards, the only way through is through.

One of the things I have discovered through my own healing is being able to FACE those emotions. They seem at first insurmountable and impossible, especially when we are bouncing between rage, fear, grief, lonliness, confusion etc etc. It is like being caught in our own hurricane and we literally are bouncing off the walls.

If we take a step back and consider WHY we are having these emotions, WHAT are our emotions trying to tell us? Simple answer "YOU IN DANGER, GIRL"

Question...when did we stop listening to ourselves? Better question...when did we START?

Our society has conditioned us to be nice, caring, pleasant, selfless, considerate, etc etc, and has discouraged us from complaining, anger, dissatisfaction the list goes on. We have been taught to hide bad feeling, and pretend we can handle it.

When is the last time someone said Hi how are you, have you responded with something like, "well actually I feel like a pile of shit right now and I want to spit in the next eye that looks sideways at me. And You?" But no, we would say "fine thank you" because we do what we are supposed to do.

The thing about feelings and emotions, they are there to serve a purpose. While we have been conditioned to ignore or deny them, a Narc experience means we no longer have that ability. It is like lifting the lid on a volcano, it is all coming out. Sometimes there is more than the Narc experience behind it. There can be a lifetime of suppressed feelings that many of us did not even know were there.

When you find yourselves asking "why does it hurt so much" "How long will it last" "Why can't I stop" it is because your body is saying "because I need to". I can only describe it as a kind of purging fire, and you will come out the other side, but rather that trying to stop any of these emotions, march right into them, explore them, allow them, examine them. It is the greatest kindness you can do for yourself because you are accepting that you can ALLOW yourself to have these feelings. You have earned the RIGHT to feel. As you allow these emotions to flow, you will begin to identify why they are there and what you need to learn from them. It sounds simplistic putting it this way and I suppose in a way it is, but allow yourself patience with your self and by little steps you will begin to move through. Sometimes it will feel like your making great strides and there will be times that you will feel you are sliding backwards.

There are many ways to healing, and different people go through different ways, but some kind of therapy is always essential. This is the way I have come through my healing, by focusing on ME and MY feelings. Whatever the Narc did for whatever reason, is no longer my concern. My only concern in that regard is ME. I now allow myself to be me.

Sep 28 - 1PM
Briseis
Briseis's picture

What a wonderful post!! I'm

What a wonderful post!! I'm right there with ya sister!! I had it described to me as "listening to your gut". My gut never spoke English, per se, but from the beginning of my Narc relationship, it was heaving and burbling and raising hell. For me, I spent the first half of my life having this "feeling" in my guts. I felt bad more than I felt good. It made me desperate to FEEL GOOD, at least some times!! It turns out I had surrounded myself, over and over again, with people who abused me, intruded across my boundaries. Friends, family, bosses, co-workers, lovers, and finally my exNarc. I knew no other way. From birth, I was beaten, or humiliated by my NPD father for my NATURAL reactions to his abuse. And in my family, you did not talk about Dad being cruel or abusive. It was the elephant in the living room but you didn't dare mention it or risk more punishment. When I finally ended the relationship with exNarc, I was on a domestic abuse board. I learned that all those horrible feelings I had all my life were my own SELF telling me to get out, get away!! And now, baby: I listen. My "gut" is 99% right. It still does not speak English LOL!! But it knows a creep when it sees one, or a creepy behavior. I no longer feel the urge to run screaming when I feel my gut churn (I did for a while). I respond now by ratcheting up my alertness. This person is . . . well, on the screwy side. Be careful. Take a step back and watch. The boundaries around me close down. I am pleasant or polite, but I am NOT letting them in. I think this is NORMAL. This is the way God or WhoEver meant us to be, gave us this instinctual sense for a reason. It is a birthright.
Sep 28 - 9AM
wholeagain
wholeagain's picture

Recommended Reading

Great post Nancy (and replies, ladies!) All very familiar, be nice, people only want to hear nice, we don't hate anyone, forgive and forget, this is how you feel, etc. If you haven't already read it, I highly recommend Women Who Run With Wolves by Clarissa Pinkola-Estes. It's aaaaall about recovering our injured instincts and intuitive nature, knowing when to be nice and when to say f*ck you, essentially. I'm reading it now for a second time--had first read it right before I left the ex--and am getting a whole new set of insights this time as I'm in a different place now. Anyway, I can't imagine there's a woman here on the board that wouldn't gain something very valuable from reading it.
Sep 28 - 9AM (Reply to #20)
better off
better off's picture

One thing I discovered while

One thing I discovered while journaling.. is that there is a difference between meeting people's needs, and meeting their expectations. As a mom, I have to meet my child's needs, and as a wife I should try to meet my husband's NEEDS, and he should mine, but trying to meet everyone's every EXPECTATION is a fool's errand. If I can meet your expectations, fine, but maybe your expectations are unreasonable or harmful, or in conflict with someone else's. I think being involved with the OM brought me to a point of critical mass in dealing with this issue. I could not please everyone, I could not make everyone happy. I loved someone and by following that I would let down a whooooole lot of people and God and myself even, and if I didn't I would be turning away the man I loved without measure... and I couldn't do either. I was totally paralyzed. It wasn't even a matter of doing or not doing what *I* wanted... because the only thing *I* wanted was to make everything right with everyone. I think part of my life was pretty close to a nervous breakdown for me. I had reached the impossible end of my life's views. I would have welcomed being institutionalized, honestly, because then I wouldn't have to decide anything. Anyway, I have to discern between EXPECTATIONS and NEEDS (mine too!) and rationally weigh what I can or can't do.
Sep 27 - 11PM
michele115 (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Nancy

This is sooo true, and something I was reflecting on myself. The messages in the media, how we are brought up, patterns we develop all play a major role in how and why we decided to surrender the way we did. I think that more focus needs to be brought to empowering young girls starting in middle school. There should be courses in self esteem - obviously, parents aren't doing enough and while I don't like adding yet another burden to the system...I think our society is at great risk. I look at the NARCS and I shake my head...something has led to their being as dysfunctional as they are. And I look around and it seems that a lot of the men out there are disordered in some way shape or form. You listen to music these days...a lot of it degrading to women - but then again, who's running the world?... I happened upon an article that I will link at the bottom. I think for us, we need to get stronger and take recovery and education seriously or we will continue to repeat the patterns. That's just my two cents and you raised a very valid and significant point. Thank you for sharing. http://www.sott.net/articles/show/214472-Pathological-Relationships-Dealing-With-a-Problem-Partner
Sep 27 - 11PM (Reply to #16)
NancyM
NancyM's picture

Michele

It is amazing really and not something I ever really considered until after really coming out of this mess was emotional security. While we run the pretense of being a civilized society, who out there ever considers emotional security to be as important as all the other "things" that are supposed to be taught. When is the last time one of our children came home from school and said "guess what Mum, we learned about self respect today". Or dignity, compassion, sharing etc. While we may be able to teach them at home (providing our emotional security is intact) we also have to teach them to survive in an increasingly narcissistic world. It seems to me that we are spinning backwards. Why is reading writing and arithmetic so important, when being a civil contributing adult is not even considered. There is nowhere that boundaries are taught, yet it is encouraged to take, take, take, me, me me. Obviously this sort of attitude requires someone to take away from. Seems to me that society is being split down the middle, and so far the Narcs are winning.

Nevergoback

Sep 28 - 12AM (Reply to #17)
michele115 (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Absolutely

And it seems more and more, that when you try to raise your children to be compassionate, sympathetic and with morals and values, they end up being bullied and the outcast...and the powers that be turn a blind eye and re-victimize the victim.
Sep 28 - 12AM (Reply to #18)
NancyM
NancyM's picture

ps

great article.

Nevergoback

Sep 27 - 10PM
better off
better off's picture

Great post, and something I

Great post, and something I have been thinking about lately. I was taught as a kid to forgive forgive forgive. Only I don't think it was really forgiveness I was doing, it was just learning (unfortunately)to set my feelings aside. There is a difference. My dad would have these tirades, and I didn't understand all of it, certainly, but he was going thru some fairly serious emotional instability, especially when I was a young teenager. And my mother was always encouraging me to the be the bigger person, to be the one to apologize after an argument, to initiate that, to be forgiving. And my dad did love me and he showed it often, but he had a terrible temper and anxiety, and an irrational streak in him when he got like that. My mom meant well, and was even right to SOME degree, but it was not good for me. I did feel like I had to set my feelings aside, and to feel guilty if I didn't. I also had an older brother, and he took out all his frustrations out on me, and really caused a lot of emotional damage, but still I thought I had to forgive. Then way later, when married to such a freaking difficult person as my husband, who, guess what?! has anxiety and a temper and an irrational streak (and a drinking problem), and says always, just to forgive forgive forgive him. And what it really means, always, is to just let it go. And I didn't know how to resolve it at all, except to either fight like mad, or just let it go. "Forgive." It's the Christian thing to do. Excep I never did forgive him. I've never forgiven him, really, for any of it. I just "let it go." Instead I became incredibly resentful and depressed. Because you know what, I've been "letting it go" since I was five years old! And then meet a narc, and like loveofmylife, start excusing stupid crap from him too. Little Miss Understanding. I'm not saying I will now NOT forgive anyone anymore. I am just now way more in touch with what I'm feeling, and that I'm ALLOWED to feel what I'm feeling, and that forgiveness where it IS required is something supernaturally gained by the help of God, and worked out in prayer and discernment, and not just something you agree to because it's "nice." I will not just "let it go." It's not selfish to care about my feelings too.
Sep 28 - 11AM (Reply to #14)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

Under what circumstances do we forgive?

You are right, it is not selfish to care about our feelings. We matter! Your post has me thinking about the meaning of forgiveness and when it is required. Christians are taught to forgive not "seven times" but "seventy times seven" meaning we are to be unlimited in our willingness to forgive others. Unfortunately, I believe this has been distorted by some to mean that we are supposed to just role over and be doormats. While Jesus taught us to "turn the other cheek" I firmly believe that we are not supposed to tolerate abuse by others. For one thing, tolerating abuse by others in any form is not good for the person doing the abusing. We should care about ourselves AND them enough to speak up for ourselves and point out to them what they are doing is wrong. I am willing to forgive anyone who is honestly sorry for what they have done AND repents and stops doing it. Only God knows the heart so I suppose there is no way we as humans can truly know if someone is sincere. However, we can see by their actions if they are repenting - turning away from the bad things they have been doing. If they don't stop their bad behavior we may forgive them in our hearts but it doesn't mean we are obligated to stick around and endure abuse. My N isn't sorry for what he did to me. I'm not even sure he realizes it because he is so wrapped up in himself and lacking in empathy. So the idea that he can be truly sorry and repentant is a little far-fetched in this case. I can choose to forgive him so that I can let it go and not hold a grudge that would be damaging to me. And I can choose to reject my urge to retaliate because that would be done from a wrong motivation. But I don't believe I am obligated to forgive him. And of course, true forgiveness that has eternal significance is what God can offer to any of us.
Sep 28 - 1AM (Reply to #12)
michele115 (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Betteroff

I understand exactly what you are saying and while our mother's meant well, they were the victims of the June Cleaver era and thought it best to raise us to be all sugar and spice leaving us RIPE for this kind of abuse. At least my mom was from the June Cleaver era; however, looking at it from a "historical" perspective, the BIBLE lays a pretty solid foundation for subsurvience of women. That's not to say we should be hell raisers, but I think that we really really need to start focusing on educating and being aware of these dangers...of the messages we're giving our children...BOYS and girls. But you hit the nail on the head. My mom had other issues (psychological) but I note when I express disasfaction with someone who has violated me, she's the first one to play devil's advocate and somehow make it like it is my duty to "understand" the injustice. It's these kinds of behaviors and messages that I believe have left a lot of us vunerable to NARC attacks. And moreover, it would explain a lot in terms of the pattern carrying over to all parts of life...stuffing the abuse from your teacher, your boss, friends, etc...then the self esteem gets beat up because it is happening on so many fronts, you start to think...oh, there must be something wrong with me...
Sep 28 - 11AM (Reply to #13)
better off
better off's picture

Funny how repentance doesn't

Funny how repentance doesn't ever seem to be as popular of a subject as forgiveness!
Sep 27 - 11PM (Reply to #4)
NancyM
NancyM's picture

letting it go

Glad you ladies liked the post and yes better off, it was exactly like that for me, "let it go" "Little Miss Understanding" and the father experience. Going back and understanding all this I realized just how set up for Narc Attack that I was. I also became little miss fix it at the age of about seven, and have learned to deal with that one as well. We all have to learn how to care for ourselves first. For many of us this is all new, because we never learned in the first place.

Nevergoback

Sep 27 - 11PM (Reply to #5)
better off
better off's picture

Agreed, I never learned it

Agreed, I never learned it in the first place. And I am the youngest in a big extended family, and I've always been small, and so, I was the one who always sat on a stool at the corner of the table when it was full (I bought a ROUND one when I grew up, so no one would ever have to sit on the corner!), who slept on the floor, who got everything last, who didn't go along if there was no room, who got crammed in wherever, who was always always always so UNDERSTANDING about it all. And praised and praised for that. I have a lot of great memories from growing up, it's not like I was seething with resentment or anything like that, but I always did feel a little bit like I didn't quite count like everyone else did. And my brother was always so jealous of me that he rejected me outright most of the time, and I think my guy issues have more to do with that than with my dad, because my dad was very sincerely affirming when he wasn't acting crazy, lol. I have never doubted his love for me even when he was angry. My brother always made me feel "less than" and he was great at the disapproving sneer, just for me being there. Existing. I didn't know then it was because he was jealous. I couldn't figure out WHY he hated me so much. I was both afraid of him AND I wanted his approval. And I was always so thrilled if I ever got INCLUDED that I was HAPPY to sleep on the floor or ride in the back corner of a truck, or whatever, if they would just let me come. See a pattern? Instead of thinking, well I have every right to be here too. I have the same right to the last piece of pie as anyone else. It's taken me 20 years to be able to overcome feeling like I am not allowed to have "the last one" of anything. And all that "forgiving" I was taught to do, the forgiving of "others," unfortunately the "others" were always male. Not a great set-up for life. I was a camp counselor and had a prank played on me by THE ADULTS, and you know why?? They chose me because I was so NICE and wouldn't get mad. Wow, what a great prize for being nice. Thanks so much. So I just swallowed it that time too, because shit, I can't get mad NOW after they said THAT. Well hell, yes, I should have. And basically, what I really meant was I can't SHOW I'm mad. I have a massive Charlie Brown complex I think. (I got a rock.)
Sep 28 - 11AM (Reply to #9)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

better off

Our stories sound very similar. I have two older step siblings and a younger sibling. I was my father's first and his favorite. He wasn't nice to his step children and they took it out on me and enlisted the youngest one too. My father had a temper and we walked on eggshells around him but he doted on me and showed me love. My mother was emotionally unavailable and perhaps deep down resented me. I don't know. Whenever I got angry about something - even if totally justified - I was made to feel like I had committed a crime. It was considered tantamount to a betrayal of trust because I was "being like him" (my dad, that is). So I learned to stuff my feelings and have spent years thinking I was deserving of resentment from my siblings. But I realize now I was just a kid! I didn't deserve their scorn. I've also spent years feeling like I can't get angry at anyone because it is practically a crime. Logic and rational thought are the only valid things - emotions are something to fear. When I met the N my feelings were so strong that I felt like I was bursting at the seams. I wanted to feel those emotions so badly that I ended up compromising myself and my morals to have it. But I also think I reverted to the role of "people pleaser" that I was taught to be which made me endure things that I should have rejected. I believe my self-esteem was much lower than I realized and I tolerated emotional abuse from him because on some level I felt I deserved it.
Sep 28 - 11AM (Reply to #10)
better off
better off's picture

I think this also has

I think this also has something to do with the fact that so many of us are around the same age.. we are so SICK of being nice and being taken advantage of... and we really aren't forgiving people deep down inside, we are being made to feel like we HAVE to "forgive" or we are bad, but we're just stuffing it and stuffing it, and then this golden opportunity seems to come (satan, the ministering angel of light) and yeah, we're bursting at the seams, as you put it. I've read a bit of Jungian psychology since all this happened, and how we have to acknowledge "the shadow" in ourselves or stuff like this will happen to force you to acknowledge it. I was desperate to break free of something and that something was NOT being MYSELF. And the damn N made me feel like I could do that with him, I could be myself, and that I SHOULD be myself. Of course... just like you, once you're in the dynamics of a relationship again, I reverted to pleasing him even though he was upsetting me. But I had invested all my hope of the future, of the right to BE ME, in him! Well, do I have the right to be me, or don't I? What does he have to do with it, you know? It was like I needed PERMISSION. Well, the only person that's going to give me permission is me. It's time to be an actual adult and stop waiting for someone else to say it's okay, it's your turn. It's taken me this long (the proverbial 18 months) to get past all that garbage, and start looking at my life with more clarity (and medication, ha ha). And I do have some things I need to forgive my husband for, or there is no point in going on. I was still struggling with enormous bitterness over the past. Some say they only seem to remember the good times with the narc, well sometimes you can only remember the bad times with a person, and that's not accurate either. And I have to say my husband has made a huge effort to control his behavior and be a kinder person. Ever since I started telling THE TRUTH. Not angry hysteria in a fight, and not, oh, allright I forgive you, but the truth. And the truth was if you don't stop hurting me, and damaging our kids in the process, I will leave for good. I've really been spending a lot of time meditating on it, on forgiveness and what it means. And what it doesn't mean. I think I fall into the EITHER OR trap. Either I would feel so frustrated and angry I would fight back and fight back hard, or I would have to capitulate to make him stop. Eventually it was mostly capitulating, because I was exhausted. I have learned through Al Anon how to find the middle way. And it's worked. And THAT is the grace of God. But he's NOT a narc, so don't anyone go thinking you can change one of THEM.
Sep 28 - 12PM (Reply to #11)
Meadowbrook
Meadowbrook's picture

There are a few good things

There are a few good things that have come out of this terrible experience. And one of them may be my acknowledgement of "the shadow" in myself. I'm trying to really examine myself and my own weaknesses in order to grow. The other positive result has been my finally coming to a willingness to truly forgive my husband. He has acknowledged the part he played in setting me up for disaster. Not that it is all his fault by any stretch. I take ownership of it. But he has been humbled because he knows what he did to contribute to my pain and vulnerability. He's tried his best to make things right between us. We had this really intense conversation not too long ago where he said, "I forgive you, but I don't think you forgive me". I was initially like, "of course I forgive you" but he kept insisting that I did not. Upon reflection I knew he was right! I really did still hold a grudge even though he had turned things around. I was like the Fonz from Happy Days with the words, "I forgive you". It was very hard to say in that context because he was asking for it to really mean something deep down in my soul and not just words. I remember having a difficult time saying it! But I did say it and I meant it and I'm not looking back. But it makes me think you are right that we aren't as naturally forgiving as we might like to believe. We're sometimes just people-pleasing and stuffing.
Sep 28 - 2AM (Reply to #6)
michele115 (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

I just had a startling memory

My mother's favorite movie was Gone With the Wind. Now let me just say, my mom has some SERIOUS Issues...a personality disorder or something that I'm only NOW beginning to realize or ACCEPT...BUT, I remember her being so much in awe of Melanie...(the one who married Leslie Howard) and she would go on and on about how sweet and kind she was, and I distinctly remember being very conscious at a very young age of making it a "Life Goal" to be just like her... Geesh! I think I would have turned out better as Scarlett! But I guess, Mom was Scarlett, so someone had to have the "supporting" role...PUN INTENDED!
Sep 28 - 9AM (Reply to #8)
better off
better off's picture

Funny, because.. I always

Funny, because.. I always felt guilty that Melanie always made me sick! I secretly admired Scarlett O'Hara... not for her manipulations or her IDIOCY over Ashley, Ashley... gag me some more. And what a pussy HE was! And I know that Scarlett was mostly a narc, obviously... but dammit, in the story, when the shit when down, SHE held it all together (which a narc would not do, a narc would have run away). And Miss Melanie laid down and died. Like it was her fault, lol. I guess I felt like the nicey nice girl wasn't REAL, it was so unreal, and the "bad" one, well she was the strong one, wasn't she? My grandmother would always say, that Scarlett O'Hara.. she was wicked! WICKED!! And I thought, well I guess I'm a little wicked too.
Sep 28 - 2AM (Reply to #7)
NancyM
NancyM's picture

Now that's what I call an

Now that's what I call an epiphany and I would bet that you are spot on. ;)

Nevergoback

Sep 27 - 10PM
loveofmylife
loveofmylife's picture

nancym

Great post. I can see how much i supressed over the years, just to be a kind and understanding person. All of the dinners he scheduled with me and canceled at the minute and I was always so understanding. All of the confusing mixed message and I always made excuses for him. I have definitely learned to be more direct in asking for clarification and to not allow someone to wiggle out of a direct explanation. Had I done so and not played his little game for so long, he would have been gone long ago and I wouldn't have lost so many years of my life!
Sep 27 - 10PM
iAmMINE
iAmMINE's picture

YES!!

GREAT POST!! ~~~ Keep Learning & Keep Healing ~~~ ~~~~~ The best revenge is to survive and be victorious over it. Nobody can take from you what you don't give them, --she said, (taken from my final remarks in a Sync Weekly Magazine article about my art and mySelf

~~~ Keep Learning & Keep Healing ~~~

~~~~~ The best revenge is to survive and be victorious over it. Nobody can take from you what you don't give them.