Guess I don't agree

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Jun 15 - 7PM (Reply to #22)
Steph's picture

No. But it shouldn't be a

No. But it shouldn't be a "lets bash lisa" board either. I think that's more like what it's turning into.
Jun 15 - 6PM (Reply to #15)
Jaded's picture

You sound overwhelmed

it seems like every time you write a long note there is something sad or stressful about your working so hard in there, about you going bankrupt or getting strep throat or losing jobs and all becaase you have gone out of your way to be helpfull. One thing I am learning in my therapy is that if I make choices first for other people they never work out. Therapy could be great for helping you focus on yourself and what you need first. Then when that is all taken care of and you have things good for you liek money and health. That would be the good time to reach out and hlep others. Like now I just feel bad for you all the time and I knwo you don;t want that. The otherlady here, Barbra, sounded really strong and like she had the will, strength and time to spend with victims and it wasn;t taking her down. More like a sports coach. I would say you need to focus on yourslef and feel better. Maybe Barbara could buy this forum from you if she got the money. How much does it cost?
Jun 16 - 6AM (Reply to #17)
Qing Yuan
Qing Yuan's picture

Why do you think b wants to buy this site?

Does she really want to buy it? Are you really suggesting that Lisa gives up the work she has done.. TO ask B is she wants to buy it? If B wanted a Site she can get one of her own surly..Its just a web site and its pretty much like any site. you get a host adress and pay the host and you set up your site. and was B strong. I dont know? I think she struggled along with the rest iof us and that whay we are all here.. But really??? That seems crazy.. My god what an insult to Lisa.. I think lisa should delete this thread before it become s free for all bashing fest... this is Lisa's web site, that she set up to help people to meet each other fior support. Its not a conselling web site ans she is not a theapist and niether was B.. if you are not happy with it then I guess its not the site fot you. B has a web address for you to concat her on.. ASk Lisa what it is? I hope this ends soon. Most people are happy here.. I am sorry that there are a few here who are not satisfied. I admit B's extensive knowledge and 'framing of arguments and oppnions' was a valuable tool for many and she really has supported so many woman (and men) here to be strong and stay NC.. but at the death, she is gone and this site belongs to Lisa. I can imagine she would shut it down long before she turned over to someone else.. and I doubt very much that B with her current struggles would want to buy it...?? Maybe I am wrong? But I would say its pretty sure fire that, that is unlikely.. v
Jun 16 - 9AM (Reply to #18)
hitandrun's picture

Barbara buying the site..that's funny

I seriously doubt Barbara wants to buy this site. She has had her own site... a blog - for many years. Just look at one of her old posts, there is a link to it. Barbara rocks, she got banned and just left with class & dignity, and that's it really. Instead of beating a dead horse, can we focus on our HEALING? I'm surprised Lisa hasn't shut the whole thing down. Being a web marketer, I am surprised she hasn't promoted the hell out of her book and affiliate products for others...that's what most website owner's do to pay the bills. Just giving you a reality check. And I am surprised Barbara didn't promote her coaching services more on the site. I found great value in her coaching. Really folks, look at other forums and see if you find any advertisements... hmmm. I wish everyone an awesome day, let's heal, do our best with NC, thank God you are no longer with a pathological,and remember you have great value. It's not easy, but most things are not. For me it is one step forward, two steps back. Looking forward to that changing : )
Jun 15 - 6PM (Reply to #16)
Steph's picture

I think it's natural for

I think it's natural for Lisa to write in a respone about how her finances are slipping.....because she had previously been accused of using this site to promote herself to make money! I think she is just trying to reiterate that she doesn't make money doing this, her intentions are selfless. I think we would all have sleepless nights or feel overwhelmed when you are constantly being critisized.....that doesn't make someone makes them HUMAN. And I don't think Lisa is coming on here and writing about all her troubles and saying woe is me.....she writes about her stresses when she is responding/DEFENDING herself. She has written posts about moving forward etc. and those were condemned as well. If I was her, I'd be pulling out my hair. Barbara was an excellent moderator, IMO too. But, like Lisa said, it is her choice to leave. She did put a lot of time and effort into this site and it is a loss she is gone. But how is that Lisa's fault? I do hope that if Barbara doesn't come back, that someone else that has some of her knowledge and time can step in as moderator. Until then, I hope this board stays. I think it is a Godsend to many people. I wish that people would stop complaining and put energy back into healing ourselves and helping others.
Jun 15 - 5PM (Reply to #12)
Jessika (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

I can't speak for all the other ladies who just posted,

however I am aware that I am responsible for myself. (in response to) "Ultimately, we are each responsible for ourselves -it is necessary at times to realise that." - Klarity
Jun 16 - 4AM (Reply to #13)
Klarity Belle
Klarity Belle's picture


It is true that every individual is ultimately responsible for themselves, but on reflection pointing out that reality at this delicate time was insensitive of me and I apologise for my previous post. Reading some of the more abusive posts here had ruffled my feathers a bit. Of course I understand that there is a lot of confusion and hurt being expressed at the moment. During recovery, a sound and solid support system is essential. For those just out of relationship with N's or P's, it is an extremely vulnerable time and looking back I remember feeling in so much pain and despair that reaching out and gaining support from those who 'got it' was a life line to me at a deeply desolate and vulnerable time in my life. My therapist and my primary online support group are still of great importance to me as I continue my recovery - not just from ex N co-parent but from childhood trauma and resulting C-ptsd. I hope that this forum survives these big changes that are going on at the moment, I can see how very important this place is to so many of it's members. It is very sad that Barbara has gone but I often felt she had so much on her shoulders moderating this forum alone - I hope she is taking a much needed rest. I am pleased that Lisa is keeping the board going for the sake of it's members but if it is to continue forward I do feel that new moderators need to be appointed. From experience of being a member on another long standing support group, good moderating is essential to the running of a sound forum. This works well when run by several or more moderators who have themselves recovered to a pretty good extent in order that they are in a good position to support and guide new members reaching out. IMO firm board guidelines/rules of operation are also essential and verbal abuse towards anyone should not be permissable. Perhaps there are a few members here who are far enough along in their own recovery process who could volunteer to co-moderate? Jessika you have the added insight from having studied and having an established career in the field of psychology - you have written some very insightful posts here. I think you would make a very good moderator. Is it something you would consider if asked? Another member who stands out to me here as someone who has walked his talk and would be good at moderating is James - it would also be good to have a male perspective on recovery from N relationships, especially for other men who may also come here seeking support. James if you read this would you consider moderating if asked? I am sure there are others here too who would make good moderators - does anyone here wish to volunteer themselves or make suggestions for who they feel would be a good moderator? It would be so sad for this board to close. Lisa I hope you don't mind me making these suggestions. This board provides a wonderful service to those seeking support and understanding about N's and P's, there are many insightful resources here too - it would be such a loss if it were to close. My good wishes to all of you here, keep strong. KB ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "The deeper that sadness carves into your being, the more joy you can contain." ~ Kahlil Gibran "That which we do not confront in ourselves we meet as fate" ~ Carl Jung

"The deeper that sadness carves into your being, the more joy you can contain." ~ Kahlil Gibran

"That which we do not confront in ourselves we meet as fate" ~ Carl Jung

Jun 15 - 5PM
AnotherPath's picture

I agree and I'm really

I agree and I'm really worried about a couple of people on this board who are in an extremely vulnerable and broken place because of the narc and the stage their at. Barbara would not only reply with her blunt in your face wake up comments but also post many links which were relevant to the victim, explaining what the motives are behind the abuser and the result this has on the victim. These links are ABSOLUTELY missing and vital.

Ending the dance

Jun 15 - 5PM (Reply to #10)
Susan32's picture

Definitely agree

Barbara's understanding on the subject is missed. She's helped me make peace with the past... and along with other posters on this board, has kept me at NC. She clarifies the situation--to the point, and makes NO EXCUSES for the abuse. She knows what she's talking about.
Jun 15 - 5PM
enoughalready's picture


I have to admit, I have been feeling somewhat lost. I have gone NC for months now due to everyone's comments from their vast amount of knowledge and experience. But I felt like Barbara has kept us altogether. And now, I feel like each day I'm losing a friend:-(
Jun 15 - 5PM
narcsurvivor's picture

I too am somewhat confused

I too am somewhat confused by all this. I haven't logged on in quite some time but I have been reading posts now and again. I did miss the whole drama that unfolded though. This forum got me through the first few weeks after cutting contact with my exN. Without Barbara hammering into me the importance of no contact, I think I would have emailed or texted my exN shortly after and continued to unsuccessfully try to get through to him, as I had been doing. This is also my first forum of this kind and only my second forum ever online. Not sure how effective it would be to have this kind of sensitive forum without a moderator that knows the subject very deeply. Worse, it could fall into the hands of the wrong people and they could seriously screw around with us. There are those of us who do not believe in no contact (i.e., those that try to see the good in their abusers) and I can see how it could create much conflict on this board between members as well as steer members back into the hands of their narcs and psychos. Not sure if the forum would be effective anymore after that.
Jun 15 - 5PM (Reply to #2)
Jessika (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

I have to say I agree G.Girl and Narcsurvivor

the vibe is significantly different. I know that I was lucky to have come to the board during the period that Barbara was present. My pain was too intense and betrayal too deep to respond to hugs and "he's a jerk." I needed to be jolted to reality of what I just experienced and told firmly to never go back .... not to respond to anything ... and then read, read, read. I needed intensity FOR my intensity. After my pain subsided, I felt so grateful that I decided to stick around and share whatever knowledge, support, and assistance I could to anyone new. This was also my first and only forum membership. Just saying that I agree with you ladies. This is definitely not the same and that is not a good thing.
Jun 15 - 8PM (Reply to #6)
better off
better off's picture

Jessika, the dust hasn't

Jessika, the dust hasn't even settled over all of this stuff. Of course things feel different, the whole thing is stressful and everyone is still trying to figure out what is going on and how they feel about it. Obviously Lisa feels blindsided and is trying to work things out as best she can. Apparently, although I can't speak for her, Barbara must have felt the same way from her point of view, and I am sorry there wasn't a better way for everyone to work out their differences. I really respect you, Jessika, but I feel you are being fairly insensitive to Lisa's position at the moment. I know you don't agree with some of what she's doing or planning to do, but I have a hard time believing you truly question her personal motives in all of this. Do you? I think it's pretty unrealistic to expect her not to be "agitated" at the moment. I would be agitated if simultaneously I was being told I had no credentials to deal with troubled, possibly suicidal people and also that I am irresponsible because I am not spending enough time dealing with troubled, possibly suicidal people. This has turned into a gigantic circle that she can't possibly satisfy. Barbara left. Lisa is still here. I guess from your comments you would prefer that Lisa shut down the site since Barbara is gone. I think that's a disservice to anyone that still would like to come here and do that. People who need more coaching and counseling should go ahead and find that. Lisa has certainly given her blessing for anyone who wants to continue with Barbara to DO SO. She can't make her stay here. I would like to continue my friendship with Barbara as well, but I don't see how this has to be automatically an "either-or" situation.
Jun 15 - 9PM (Reply to #7)
Jessika (not verified)
Anonymous's picture

Hi Better off

Now you know it's absolutely impossible for me to say something briefly- so get comfortable. Well- I have a couple of "no's" coming ... No of course I don't think Lisa should shut down the site bc Barbara is gone. I really don't. It does feel different and that's bc I liked the hard core approach and I'm really going to miss it. I respected her bc she had a lifelong exposure to pathologicals and really learned all that she could about the disorder. She knows more than many PhDs I know. I just liked the 'in your face' approach. I know some don't and perhaps it's not best all the time... but it pulled me back from some dark moments. So, much of what I shared initially was about that. I didn't realize I was coming off as insensitive- I'll be cognizant of that in the future. I guess I'm the type Better-Off who truly believes in constructive critism and thought I was giving that. However, I will pay attention (when it comes to Lisa) bc as I shared before I have respect for her and admire what she has created. Now if someone else steps to me about my opinion -- LOL --- that's another story! I guess I don't like when she tells us there are relationship and occupational problems; however she is also stating she is ready to treat. I think maybe if she were conducting ADHD evals it would be no big deal if she is stressed, however seeing a population that is so distressed themselves may be difficult at this time- so I agreed with Jaded. That wasn't meant as a slight. With me ... it may help to get a feel for my posts if you know my orientatino and my orientation is that I DO like her. I guess I'm speaking to her as though I am speaking to a sister lately. Telling her you seem SO awesome at X (media for example)... however I'm worried about Y (SR treatment). IDK - I'm used to just being honest with people and I suppose many people (when they make a critique) are doing it bc they DON'T like the person. No, I don't question her personal motives in this. I actually think Lisa SHOULD be making some major money, bc I like the way she comes across on television and the whole cartoonish marketing here is really appealing-- it will bring light to the subject of narcissism. I wasn't one of the ones who thought she was doing this for money. LOL -- I think she's onto something here and could be making MORE money! As a psychologist (you've heard my lecture Better-off) I get worried bc I know it took me years to prepare for populations who suffer with PTSD, depression, and anxiety-- which is the state of mind our Ns/Ps leave us. One of the first things you learn is that of the psychological problems, this is the group you have to be aware of are most at risk for suicide. So when Narcnarc shared that info about SR and that the N/P abuse population will be her clients I became really concerned. Not bc I don't want her to make money or help others ... more bc SR seemed like psych treatment and not support/ coaching. I didn't think telling her that would hurt her feeling though. I think what I understood SR to be was 'more' than coaching... there was a treatment plan or modules that she would create for her clients. This treatment plan was constructed by her. So I asked myself - "where does the knowledge base come from to do this?" To me that seemed like practicing psychology rather than coaching. That is why (LOL) you saw this typically quite, sweet one get all up in arms. I not only became worried for the patient, but worried for Lisa. Additionally, given my exposure to Lisa, her knowledge base regarding advice didn't seem as vast as Barbaras. I hope that didn't come across as abrasive or rude - it's just an observation and has nothing to do with who I like. As far as her being on the board more -- I'm not one who shared that belief. She has a job and that simply isn't possible. Moderator/no moderator -- IDK... that's up to her. I would say that it was comforting to know that at least one person would always address your posts with helpful info. I went back and read the original message that started this thread; the first time I read it I just went through it quickly and didn't pick up some of the comments. I do now see that there were some things that Lisa was likely responding to and became annoyed with. Still don't think she should've threatened to take away her toy, though (you know what I mean). I think that might have jolted some newbies. No I don't question her motives; YES I think she should be making money :o) Yes I am concerned about SR bc from what I know (I may have it wrong) she's not offered one on one assistance before; NOOOOOoooooooo I don't dislike her; Yes- I'm capable of liking Barbara and Lisa simultaneously- however I have an actual bond with Barbara; and wow - I'm surprised that I came off as insensitive and I will pay attention so that I don't come off like that in the future, as I am not a disrespectful or angry person. I will say though-- there was one time in this thread that I was purposely being insensitive -fyi. And thanks for communicating the way that you did ---- reminds me of someone I know! :o) xoxoxo Jessika
Jun 15 - 5PM (Reply to #3)
ACgirl's picture

I agree too...

When dealing with these issues, you have to be tough. I for one, am not tough. Barbara was great. She was strong. You have to be strong to survive. I wish I were stronger. Love is important. And there is a lot of love on this board, and that is a good thing, to be sure. This forum was started out of love, care and concern. And I can still feel that. But Barbara was like a Marine Col who would slap you upside your head and say... Stand tall Soldier. And that is what I needed.
Jun 15 - 5PM (Reply to #4)
Jessika (not verified)
Anonymous's picture


So true ACgirl .... LOL!! (in response to) "Barbara was like a Marine Col who would slap you upside your head and say... Stand tall Soldier" -- ACgirl
Jun 15 - 7PM (Reply to #5)
hitandrun's picture

Agree...Barbara is missed

I wasn't going to come back because the vibe has changed so much. Don't have any comments about Lisa accept "Thanks for making the forum available." Have not worked with her, only know her from this forum and her book. I am VERY THANKFUL she has made this forum available. If not for this forum, not sure when I would have found out that my ex was very disordered and it wasn't all my fault. Now Barbara, that's a whole different deal. I actually had a coaching session with her and if I hadn't, I think my head would still be in a VERY BAD PLACE. She told the truth, like it was, shared her experience, and was obviously very knowledgeable. I,too, miss her kicking my butt(in only the way Barbara can)and her informative extras(blog posts,etc.) Not bashing Lisa.She has a full-time job. You can't moderate properly when you work 9-5 and sometimes more. Just acknowledging that I personally think Barbara did an amazing job and she will be missed. If I hadn't come in contact with Barbara through this board, I shudder to think where I would be right now...probably in the grave(or the mental hospital!) And I also acknowledge that if Lisa had not made this forum available, I would not have found Barbara.