How could he deviate so much?

Isn't that bad?! Did you read the list you made of his N traits?? I'm not sure why you're questioning if he's bad or not... What you should be asking: What do I want in my life? What do I deserve? Who am I alone and not in a 'relationship'? Am I healthy? I understand that you want to minimize his behavior and 'see the good things' about him. In all reality: it doesn't matter. I recommend re focusing your attention on you and your life, your emotional and physical health and just plain STOP thinking about him. I know it's hard. For me, the more time away from him the better I am. I refuse to spend my precious time thinking about him. If he's not giving me money for the children, I'm not spending an ounce of energy trying to figure him out. I just don't understand crazy. Good luck to you! You deserve so much better than that crazy psycho N. Love, Lilly

He is a narc like my ex husband, who did not possess all of the horrible traits but was clinically diagnosed as well. It is what it is and feel blessed that you didn't endure the worst of the possibilities. I didn't in him but did in narc #2. Bottom line, it is still devastating, painful, and you are still left not understanding, lost........but you will heal and find your way home. You are fortunate to have not had to deal with the ugly monster that he could have potentially been. Stay strong Sea! You will heal.

You are having Cog Dis. He has been diagnosed. Not all of them will meet all the criteria 100 percent of the time. xN drove like a 90 year old woman and doesn't stalk (at least not that I am aware of). She is no less Narc because of this. One key I think is consistency. Did he consistently make you feel bad? If he didn't you would not be here. I say this with love. Don't second guess yourself. Not listening to your instincts is bad. I know because I ignored them for years. Take care of you right now sweetie. xx. Rose

Same with me Sea. The narc wasn't overtly abusive. He was very very subtle. I asked myself many times if he was the one. I have been D&Ded just once, not too severly, but enough to feel totally broken. He was pushy/pully, hot/cold. But quite polite. He absolutely lacked empathy(the most common definition of a narc) You know what made me finally believe he is a narc? The impact this r/ship had on ME. During the entire r/ship I felt bad-bad-bad. Anxious, empty, devalued. Lost my mind. Got addicted, enormous CD, started having panic attack. I could have thought it is ME... BUT he is the 5th man in my life. And never ever I experienced anything similar. Not all of my r/ships were easy. I had hearbreak in the past. Sad, hurt, in pain - defenetely. But never did I feel so devalued, objectified, used, empty. All those symptoms match with what I read about the narc survivors. What if you try to compare YOUR emotions and devastation with the ones of narc survivors and people who just split with their loved ones? Love Winter

Sweet lover in bed Never violent No gambling of heavy drinking (smoked pot) Did not lean on me financially even though unemployed (somehow had money??) Never stalked me Never drove crazy Never yelled or cursed at me but worse emotional neglect and abuse imaginable - at least 4 major silent treatments in 10 years, then abandonment, then one hoover a year later (in same sweet low key character) then abandoment again - it has been much rougher than recovering from sexual abuse (was attacked once by an "acquaintance") and physical abuse (an ex BF attacked me once long ago). At least you know what happened. This stuff leaves your mind whipped - WTF happened here? how did I get here? who was I with? the horror of knowing your love was never appreciated or reciprocated... nice quiet N's are just as destructive, just more polite or stealth about it.

....they are ALL 'bad". The lists of traits we see on PD's includes a very large spectrum. As Goldie pointed out, it all depends on that individual PD's upbringing, and make up. Just because someone isn't punching you in the face doesn't mean he isn't raping your soul. My abuser is of the violent variety. The emotional torture he doled out was just as bad, if not worse. It was the mental abuse that made me suicidal. The bastard! Sumiko, I just think that obsessing over these lists isn't always the best thing for us, especially in our early recovery. Once we have that "lightbulb" moment reading about PD's, rest assured, we are with one! That is what the lighbulb moment is, when you KNOW in your GUT this is what you have been dealing with. Let's focus on US, and US getting better- we already KNOW they are screwed up! love~ Layla

We have discussed this in the past, not so much recently. Many of the Narcs whom you describe in the first list are also addicted to drugs, porno, ect., don't have steady income and are not willing or able to pay for things. A Narc with good income will pay for things if they can and choose to do so. Some well to do narc's are cheap, it all depends on that particular narc. The whole abuse in bed thing is not always the behavior of all narcs. This depends on their sexual orientation and of course a psychopathic narc is going to be more abusive in bed. A violent narc may be more controlling and abusive in bed. Depends if he you and your narc are in the violence abuse cycle. Some are, some are not. I was molested as a child and cannot and do not tolerate abuse in bed, so I have never been with a narc who was overtly abusive in bed. Sure, I've had the withholding and lack of intimacy type of sex, but never violent or cruel sex. I must have a boundery in that area, none of them ever even tried. I think they get away with what you allow them to get away with. I had severe lack of financial bounderies and was taken to the cleaners by one of them financially and of course the constant lying and one of them was physically abusive and had major anger issue's. Behavior at that time which I tolerated for several months until I began to refuse to accept it anymore. We have more power than we think we do and perhaps you have strong bounderies in certain area's of your life and have been able to repel that type of narc and those type's of behaviors. As far as the physical abuse, towards you, or punching holes in walls and things of that nature, this is not always the case with narcs, some are violent some are not, this also depends on their orientation, if their father's were violent they will have more of a tendency, if they are on drugs, and if they have psychopathic tendencies and you cross them you may see them get violent when usually they are not. It's a mixed bag. Some of the members on here think that all narcs are abusive because their narcs have been that way and this is not always the case. I have seen both types. A narc is a narc, though, and whether or not he is materially cheap and or abusive does not mean that your life with them will not be pure hell and shear torture. Money does not buy love and a generous narc is no picnic. Having him buy you things, take you on trips, ect..does not by any stretch assure happiness with anyone. You still have the narc with you whether you are wealthy or poor financially. Sounds like your situation is a perfect example of this, even though he does not hurt you physically or financially, he sure has done a number on you emotionally. God bless, Goldie

just like there are many flavors of ice cream and even say vanilla, the narcs are the same way, they do not have all the same characteristics, mine never did drugs, never physically abused me, was great in bed and gentle, drank some but not an alcoholic,held jobs for long times.I cannot say for sure mine is NPD, i am not a psychologist but I do know he has many similar traits, and therapists say look at a persons past relationships and mine has had 5 failed relationships, so that alone is a big red flag. Look at i this way, if someone mistreats you, does not respect you,is abusive in any form, isn't that enough to walk away????