Not what I expected...

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#1 Jun 20 - 12AM

loveofmylife

Not what I expected...

Well, I'm back after a few weeks. This board has been such a godsend. My prediction was that N would final D&D me the day the business we turned around got refinanced, as our contractual relationship would be over, as since he told me he no longer wanted a personal relationship with me - that once the defined business relationship was over, he would split out of my life for good.

Well, I think ACgirl posted once that she wished he would contact her again so that she could be the one that does the final dump...or something like that... and sadly I've been thinking the same thing...how can I be the one to end it quickly with NC so that he doesn't do it to me!? (i know it sounds immature, but I couldn't stand the thought of being D&D'd by him again)

Well, our final close is now in three days. Last week he was constantly offering help and being super helpful and sweet. conversations on the phone that involved alot of laughing and fun. (what I always thought was normal).... and then yesterday he called and wants to meet with me tomorrow (I haven't seen him in two months, after I asked him to stop coming to the company, because every time I saw him my heart would race, I couldn't breath, and would start crying when he left)

He wants to meet because the new company he is running manufacturers a product that my company needs desperately...something we had to get from China in the past, but needed to get locally.

I would so badly like to see him and try to get some straight answers...yes, the "no closure" as people say because we never will get a straight answer:

- why do you want to enter into a NEW relationship with me when you have already betrayed our relationship behind my back? I thought you told me you wanted nothing from me anymore?
- Why would you want to enter into a NEW relationship if our last one was so full of conflict? Is there no one you can verbally abuse at your new company? No one will let you get away with it because they haven't loved you as long?
- Is this so you can get me all lathered up again, so that when I try to cross the line you can tell more new victims that you have a highly ranked woman after you?
- Have you contacted all of the women that you betrayed me to and told them you were dishonest by omitting the fact that you really did lead me on for 20 years and that my loving you was not because you "had no role whatsoever"?
- What are these women going to think when they find out you pursued a new relationship with the woman you said was making you uncomfortable at work because she loved you?

I would just love to point out to him and contrast what happened between us to what happens between two people who really are "just friends".

But I get back to - I can't believe that someone who has D&D'd you several times would seek to continue a relationship with you. Just like everything is normal; without ever apologizing for those D&D's.

If anyone could think of some witty things to do if I see him in person....I kind of would like this final opportunity to call him to the table of...WTF were you doing to me for 20 YEARS of my LIFE and do you really think I want you to USE ME for another 20 YEARS!!!!!!!!!

#2 Jun 20 - 8AM

Monica

loveofmylife...is it a full moon or something?? Me, too...

11 weeks NC on Friday then BAM. He comes waltzing back into my life. Because of an incident that happened in my office Thursday, I did expect to hear from him Friday about that. It was almost unavoidable. Had already talked with my therapist to prepare myself. So it wasn't a total shock when he called me. It was expected. However, he wasn't calling about what I thought. Stupidly, I agreed to meet with him because I thought he needed to discuss this incident - a business matter...just like your situation. Only to have him totally muck up my life once again. If I could do is all over again, I would refuse to meet with him. If it really was business, I would insist on having someone else there with us. I was blindsided. I have been in clinical shock since Friday. I think I've lost 5 pounds over the weekend. Have hardly eaten a thing. But I've had way too much wine. NOT GOOD. I have had chest pains since Friday and notice that I actually stop breathing now and again. Oh, geez.... Loveofmylife...I don't know what to tell you. It would be hypocritical of me to tell you not to meet with him on the business matter. I would warn you to expect to be blindsided, expect to be setback, expect an attempt to put you back on the roller coaster. I don't think we can really prepare ourselves for that. I was still too new out of it to be emotionally strong enough for the things he told me. Having business connections with these creatures - especially in this economy - is absolutely horrible. Not as bad as having kids with them but sort of the same thing. You HAVE to deal with them on some level because you have little choice in some circumstances. In mine, I was a witness to something that happened. I had no choice. Then it turned out to not be about that at all! Ugh. If I lived near you, I would offer to either hold you back from meeting with him or I'd go with you!! I am thinking about you. I hope my post isn't too late for you and arrives before you have to make the decision about meeting him. Know that I am thinking about you and know exactly what you are going through.

#3 Jun 20 - 2AM

NancyM

Closure

Finding closure to it all is a very difficult hurdle to get over because we keep searching for some sort of humanity in there and we really believe that somehow if they see our pain they will somehow wake up. Even though we are constantly convinced that we can't get it we still try. My experience was a little different in that when I went through the last stages of the relationship I had not been able to find anybody that knew what I was talking about but I did have a vague understanding of narcissism. So what I did in the end was went looking for the narcissist within. I did not know about NC or D&D at this time but I got to a point that I was studying him because I thought that people just had to be told what this thing was. If it could happen to me three times it must be happening to scores of people. I must say how totally stunned I was when I found out the truth of this. Anyway here are some of the things I did. You must remember that at this time he had been to treatment and had been HEALED apparently (after a narcissistic injury because I initially left him)so I must admit I pushed him a bit harder than I would have before. I was talking to him about our relationship and was telling him how much it helped me how he could point out my issues so I could address them because I often doubted myself. Then I asked him if he ever did that. His answer was a flat unequivocal NO. I asked him if he EVER had. He said maybe once he may have had some doubts (about 20 years previously when his first wife dumped his ass) but no, not since then. Besides he wouldn't be able to do his job if he had ANY doubts about himself. I smiled at him and said ..... hmmmm, how interesting. Especially for someone that had been willing apparently to end his life six months previously and had to have intensive counseling etc etc. Yet he had never doubted himself through all of it. This made me realize how premeditated ALL of his actions were. After this I went looking for the real reasons behind his words and actions. Sad to say I knew I had found the devil. Another time he was telling me how deeply he loved me and was sorry that he simply had not been able to show me but he would love me forever blah blah blah. There were tears and all, the show was an oscar winner. I unfocused my eyes, looked away and sighed saying something totally random like "Do you think it will rain today? MY garden really needs it." He immediately snapped into a rage accusing me of being cold callous blah blah blah. I said ...hmmmm how interesting! On asking what I meant I said that if the roles had been reversed that is exactly what he would have done to me. One way street huh? Then I casually got up and said, anyway I need to start on dinner, and left him sputtering. Our last encounter I told him I wanted to sell the house that we co own and I mostly pay for. After getting in a crappy mood which I ignored I offered him that he could go away and think about it for a few days if he needed to. Hahaha that enraged him because I took his usual punishment away. And you guessed it, I said ...hmmmm how interesting. Another time he was accusing me of being crazy for the trillionth time and I turned and snarled at him, "It may serve you well to remember that because it is a dangerous thing to leave someone with nothing left to lose because you make them capable of ANYTHING. THAT'S what you are doing to me" I dead set swear I saw fear cross his eyes and I walked straight up to him, cocked my head as I peered into his eyes and said.. hmmmmm how interesting. He was stunned. I had stopped looking for the human and started looking for the monster. After all that loveofmylife, are you absolutely sure his company manufactures this product or is he just jerking your chain? Sounds suspect to me and he is probably setting you up for another fall.

Nevergoback

#4 Jun 20 - 1AM

ACgirl

Narcs wont let you get closure

I happened to read your post and I wanted to tell you this from my experience. What a coincidence you mentioned my post. Every time I made the choice to see my narc to get closure, I NEVER did. I always thought I could handle it, but I couldn't. He would always do something charming that would lure me in. And you said it, they will NEVER give you a straight answer. My N asked me to meet him in December. I thought he was going to tell me he missed me. But NO!! He had me drive out to a restaurant to tell me that he was seeing someone else, blah blah blah. This was right before New Years Eve!! He totally F'd my mind up. I cried like a baby for hours. Then two months later, he calls and says...he loves me, misses me, doesn't want to loose me, so what did I do. Of course, I went and saw him and he was distant to me. Then I find out again he is banging someone else. Then the big d&d. I haven't heard from him. Yes, I would love for him to call to I can NC him. I admit to the ranks of a child. But hey. Anyway, my advice, PLEASE don't see him. You will feel SO much better if you turn him down. No good will come of it. I wish to God I would have done that. PLEASE, DON'T SEE HIM. Don't do what I did. You have a chance to win this round. Take control. You will feel so much better. You will feel stronger. If he is expecting to see you, then you can just send him an email and say... "Hey, sorry I can't make it, something came up. Just send me an email about...blah blah regarding work.". Don't see him. I repeat, no good will come of it. Learn from ACgirls mistakes. Now I know about this forum. It will save your life. Good luck. You sound like a GREAT lady.

#5 Jun 20 - 8AM (Reply to #6)

Monica

ACgirl...it doesn't matter WHAT they tell you when they ask to

see you. Whether they do what yours did..."He had me drive out to a restaurant to tell me that he was seeing someone else, blah blah blah. This was right before New Years Eve!! He totally F'd my mind up. I cried like a baby for hours..." or ask to see you to try to hoover you back in again by telling you how great you are and that they are in love with you and want to talk for hours with you. The result is the same... He totally F'd my mind up. I cried like a baby for hours. Doesn't matter WHAT they say to you...it is breaking NC and the results will be the same no matter what...they will totally F*CK up your mind. Period. Good post!

#6 Jun 20 - 5AM (Reply to #4)

Scoop

it took me a while to get

it took me a while to get the no closure thing . Mine would d&d me then contact me saying "lets meet up " and i would think excellent he wants to get back together ... but noooo he wanted me to ask him to get back together so he could then d&d me ALL OVER AGAIN which now i know must have been such a high for him , he must have felt like a god or something . because can i just point out to members ,as there is no need for modesty at this point of our healing , on the social scale of things i am way better than him in every way , class ,looks intelligence , respect from peers ect , him being with me elevated his status so when he got to d&d me he in his sick twisted way of looking at things elevated himself . It gave him such confidence he went off the scale ... but heres the problem in his game when i am not around he cant mantain the confidence and he crumbles like a house of card , so he starts the hover and depending on how much confidence he needs dictates how long the hover will last it goes like this .... he knows i want to get back with him thats a given so he starts with his opening gambit that we will "just be friends " so he invites me to events , partys ect and of corse i have to stay the night but being just friends the dress code has changed in bed he dons boxer shorts and i a nighty . We sleep in each others arms thats still the same (nice bonding trick there ) this can go on for a week or last summer it went on for about 5 weeks . The last couple of times i made a point of not asking to get back togther at all i just went along with the friends thing to see what woud happen as i figgered he is a man and eventualy he will crack . It was quite funny when he did as this school boy mask would come out and he would try and put his hand on my stomach just casual like lol and then it would move it up or down with him gageing my reactions .....arrrrgggggg! what have i been doing the past 2 years . When i see it in black and white its all so pathetic .It is great to fit the pieces into the puzzle but that has only come from 3 months no contact . I am leaning more and more to the right side of congnitive disonance ..... Do you know what has helped so much to make this shift , there is a man who i have known for a long time who is lovely , and he asked me this week to go to stonehenge for the solstice with him .. it is a date and i said no as i am not ready but he asked and thats enough for me .Ladys this man is a catch , good job , hot with a future . actualy it was him that gave me the strenght to go no contact with my narc as he expressed an intrest at christmas .. and you know what . he is wating till im ready .. now thats unheared of right ? Scoop x

#7 Jun 20 - 2PM (Reply to #5)

loveofmylife

Eery patterns here....

Scoop - just like you - no need for modesty during the healing process...N and I are on similiar "social levels", intelligence levels, his pretend class level, although he has maintained his boyish looks a bit longer and his body is definitely the rock.... but, the women he has been dating are a WAY lower social status in terms of class (manners, values, chastity on 1st dates, etc). So it is really potent ammo for him to drop by name/title/etc to these other gloating victims to tell them he has had to say no to me. And looking back on it, I really do think he strung me out and said no to me taking him out for his bday (when we have gone out for YEARS) just so he would have a cool story about him "needing" to turn me down to LURE some new victims in. "Wow, what a cool guy, and in demand! He must have morals and virtues and everything if he can turn her down". And yes, like you say - it must be an incredible thrill to be able to do this with a woman of high status; must make his sex all the more exciting with his bimbos. "he knows i want to get back with him thats a given so he starts with his opening gambit that we will "just be friends " so he invites me to events , partys ect" Yes, and the realization that "wow - no matter what I do to her, she is always there for me. How fun! This could keep me going for a lifetime!" And yes, when I am not around, I think he feels like he is floundering. I've been to social events with him, and surpringly he is very uncomfortable around strangers and stays glued to me all night and is very nervous. Contrast that to how comfortable he feels behind closed doors with me, like he controls our entire relationship and can do what he wants with me. God they are all the same.. And Scoop, I'm so happy to hear about the new man! Can't wait for this story to unfold! I can hear alot of healing in your voice... you don't sound as confused and emotional anymore. So good for you! And it seems smart for you to wait a bit longer....to let the dust settle and regain your sense of YOU again so that you meet a man that is a nice compliment to the REAL YOU, and not the injured you.

#8 Jun 20 - 2AM (Reply to #2)

loveofmylife

acgirl

I'm sorry, but your post made me laugh so hard...it is just how ridiculous they are! I'm imagining this N calling up his 5 year girlfriend to meet him for dinner...her with great anticipation..just so he can break the news "I'm seeing someone else...just thought you'd like to know!" What an N!!!!! It reminds me so much of the scene in Legally Blonde where he takes her out to a fancy dinner and calls her "poo bear" just to break up with her. Oh god...its almost comical, if it weren't so real. I would have reacted in the exact same way as you...with great anticipation that he would see the light and say that he misses me...and actually talks to me in a straight manner and gives me straight answers.....like, "I have loved you for 20 years and I do really want to spend the rest of my life with you." But it will never happen. He will only say "I really think your company would benefit greatly by working with my company. And if it is too much for you to handle emotionally, I don't know what to say. That is your problem, and good luck with that. " And yes, I can never handle the "trying to get closure" meetings either because he somehow always outsmarts me and shuts me in a box. And just like you, everytime I get No Closure I cry for hours....because I JUST WANT ANSWERS! I'm not stupid and I didn't misinterpret 20 years of relationship. I just want him to come clean and either say "yes, I've always loved you", or "yes, I admit I am a total N and a player". But he makes me think I misinterpret everything and he has never overstepped any boundaries. And yours will contact you again...so you will have your chance to NC. (just don't open the next email and get upset! Have you put him on blocked on your email, so he'll get a nice little bounceback when he emails next?) So what is a really good way to turn him down here!? I just want it to be crisp and send a message! I do like your email idea. Last time he told me he was stopping by to see me, and I didn't respond, and then told me "I'm stopping by your company whether you are there or not!"...sweet thing to say. I was quite proud of myself for texting him 15 minutes before we were supposed to meet "sorry, I had to get my watch fixed and decided to go out to lunch" So perhaps something similar. Setup a time and have to get my teeth cleaned or something like that. But that is childish...

#9 Jun 20 - 11AM (Reply to #3)

ACgirl

Loveofmylife, Scoop, it really is comforting....

I loved your posts because it really is comforting when someone else knows what you have been through. For years I thought I was the only one who knew someone like that. Hah!! These sicks bastards are all over the place!! When he D&D'd me last year I shut down my email address and he got so angry. He called me 10 times and left messages as to how upset he was. Then I felt bad to see him so hurt, so I called him. As soon as I got him on the phone he said... "I was so upset, please let's try to work this out". Of course, because I am so loving (that is what we girls here are) I said okay and was (as the saying goes) forced to eat crow!! If it wasn't for this forum I would be CLUELESS at to what was going one. The reason why I can't block his emails is that on my web address, if you block someone they think it goes through, you just can't see it. And I would want him TO SEE that I am blocking his ass. Yes, I too am being childish. But hey.... Scoop, you made me realize something I have never thought about. I think it made him VERY excited to rejected me like an old pair of socks. If I too may be bold, I have a pretty exciting career in the entertainment business. He has never been anywhere near the entertainment business. I took him to exciting parties, awards shows, etc. I also have my own money and I have been told I'm very attractive. His other women are.....how do I say this, no where near my level of intelligence, at all. They don't have "real" careers. I call them bimbos. So, I think for him to reject me was extra special. Probably got him sweating with excitement to reject me. Loveofmylife, I think you should just send him a business like note, very business like and tell him that he should "feel free to tell you about all the business info in the email and thank him so very much. Have a great day!!" LOL, it will spin his universe. You are giving him back the same piece of lard he gives you. I mean, no contact is the way to go, but if you must respond, then make is cool, no emotion, a total "zero" attitude. When I did that to my N this past March when he started to hoover me in, it drove him crazy. Of course, I finally gave in, which was my mistake. So you, be Cool!! Act like his boney ass is not all that!!

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